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New Elizabeth V3 owner


Caffeinated_fiend
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1 hour ago, MediumRoastSteam said:

@Caffeinated_fiend - mine locks just roughly at 6:30 with a bottomless PF and the VST. It doesn’t mean yours should be the same. As long as it’s locked in, you are good. Saying that, if yours lock at 5 o clock, you are likely over tightening it.

I’m very particular with my equipment. Usually, when things change, I tend to notice. I have not noticed any changes with the silicone gasket yet. I’ve been using them for years. I never noticed any loosening. 

 

Thank you, half 6 sounds about right, I put 5 but I meant 7. Mine hasn’t been past the padlock yet on any of the baskets. I’m blaming the amount of coffee I drank yesterday 😂

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Random question of the day,

How stable should the pressure be on the Manometer? I have noticed what seems to be a gradual decline since owning the machine. 

If I’m putting 18g in each time will there be much play between coffees? I know that the pressure declines through the shot but my starting pressure seems to have declined over time. 
 

Does using the blank basket give you the pressure that the OPV is set to? I wonder if having the filter onto the tubing has any effect. 
 

On the plus side I had a nice latte with the Milk Buster beans this morning. Certainly busy through the milk, puts hairs on your chest in a latte. 

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2 hours ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

Random question of the day,

How stable should the pressure be on the Manometer? I have noticed what seems to be a gradual decline since owning the machine. 

If I’m putting 18g in each time will there be much play between coffees? I know that the pressure declines through the shot but my starting pressure seems to have declined over time. 
 

Does using the blank basket give you the pressure that the OPV is set to? I wonder if having the filter onto the tubing has any effect. 
 

On the plus side I had a nice latte with the Milk Buster beans this morning. Certainly busy through the milk, puts hairs on your chest in a latte. 

Gradual decline when brewing coffee is normal. After all, it’s pressure, and, if the puck is giving way to resistance gradually - so the coffee can flow through the basket - a gentle decline in pressure is absolutely normal.

when you have the blank disk when backflushing, all he pressure goes through the expansion valve, as the other outlet - the group - has been blanked off. So that’s your benchmark. If you want to complicate things, water expands when hot, so if you set the OPV with a cold machine you’ll get a lower reading compared to a fully warmed up machine.


for the same reason you don’t see any pressure build up if there’s no resistance on the group, through ground coffee or blank disk. The water simply has no resistance, and free flows. 
 

Edited by MediumRoastSteam
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Current: Lelit Elizabeth / Niche Zero / VST baskets / Distilled water + 100mg NaCO3/L

Previous: Gaggia Classic | Eureka Mignon | Rocket Cellini Evo | Profitec 700 | Profitec T-64 | Gene Cafe CBR-101 | Kinu M68 | Feldgrind 2 | La Pavoni Europiccola 2012

Also at: CoffeeTime Forum & Niche Zero Owners Group

 

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Cleaned the shower screen today and thought while I have it I will install the silicone gasket. 
 

The other picture shows where the portafilter fits into the group when the VST basket is being used. 
 

I pulled a 28 second shot with 18g in the basket, pressure went up to just below 9 on the manometer and by the end of the shot was barely in 8. I’m assuming that is just the VST basket as the IMS generates that bit of extra pressure due to the shape of it. 
 

The VST also speeds up in the second half of the shot, reminds me of my Sage machine, whereas the IMS seems to hold the same flow rate through the shot. Also my puck always sticks to the shower screen with the VST

2F832C29-E459-4A75-A086-8C3EC22DAE4C.jpeg

90669373-72CB-4D7E-BF22-AA974E0A5281.jpeg

Edited by Caffeinated_fiend
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18 minutes ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

Also my puck always sticks to the shower screen with the VST

Check:

 

21 minutes ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

The other picture shows where the portafilter fits into the group when the VST basket is being used. 

That's strange. I just checked mine. With the VST 18g and the OEM portafilter that came with the machine, it locks at 6 o'clock. With my ECM bottomless, it locks at 6:30. Are you sure you have:
- dried up and cleaned all up before fitting the new gasket;
- pushed it all the way up. Use your fingers to start with, and then lock the portafilter in, with a basket, all the way as far as it will go past 6 o'clock. This ensures the gasket is fastened and snug fit properly against the group.
- the shower screen is not tightened to the point that the dispersion plate squashes the gasket. The retention screw should only be fastened as far as the shower screen no longer spins on the dispersion plate. This is literally finger tight with a 1/4 turn to nip up.

 

 

 

 

Current: Lelit Elizabeth / Niche Zero / VST baskets / Distilled water + 100mg NaCO3/L

Previous: Gaggia Classic | Eureka Mignon | Rocket Cellini Evo | Profitec 700 | Profitec T-64 | Gene Cafe CBR-101 | Kinu M68 | Feldgrind 2 | La Pavoni Europiccola 2012

Also at: CoffeeTime Forum & Niche Zero Owners Group

 

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36 minutes ago, MediumRoastSteam said:

Check:

 

That's strange. I just checked mine. With the VST 18g and the OEM portafilter that came with the machine, it locks at 6 o'clock. With my ECM bottomless, it locks at 6:30. Are you sure you have:
- dried up and cleaned all up before fitting the new gasket;
- pushed it all the way up. Use your fingers to start with, and then lock the portafilter in, with a basket, all the way as far as it will go past 6 o'clock. This ensures the gasket is fastened and snug fit properly against the group.
- the shower screen is not tightened to the point that the dispersion plate squashes the gasket. The retention screw should only be fastened as far as the shower screen no longer spins on the dispersion plate. This is literally finger tight with a 1/4 turn to nip up.

 

 

 

 

The machine really was clean as a whistle when I changed the gasket, in fact the fit is exactly the same as with the OEM gasket. I can get the portafilter to 6 with the OEM basket as you can see in the video, however the VST most likely wouldn’t go to 6 even with a lot of pressure. 
 

The dispersion plate is tightened as you suggested.

 

http://caffinatedfiend.quickconnect.to/mo/sharing/ru9cZhhPy

 

The coffees a little old but it’s all I have left at the minute. 

Edited by Caffeinated_fiend
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30 minutes ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

Is that with the new gasket and VST basket? 

Looks all good to me. One day, eventually, when you open the machine up, you may wish to increase the pressure a little. Personally, I'd just leave as is. That's very similar to what I have (maybe mine is 0.5 bar higher, if that). 

Current: Lelit Elizabeth / Niche Zero / VST baskets / Distilled water + 100mg NaCO3/L

Previous: Gaggia Classic | Eureka Mignon | Rocket Cellini Evo | Profitec 700 | Profitec T-64 | Gene Cafe CBR-101 | Kinu M68 | Feldgrind 2 | La Pavoni Europiccola 2012

Also at: CoffeeTime Forum & Niche Zero Owners Group

 

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13 minutes ago, MediumRoastSteam said:

Is that with the new gasket and VST basket? 

Looks all good to me. One day, eventually, when you open the machine up, you may wish to increase the pressure a little. Personally, I'd just leave as is. That's very similar to what I have (maybe mine is 0.5 bar higher, if that). 

That was with the OEM basket and new gasket, pressure is lower with VST, starts under 9 and stays just within 8 with the VST. I will have to try removing the filter as it was a little higher before I put that in. I wonder if that has any effect, I am using Tesco Ashbeck water but I put the Lelit filter in as well, you can probably hear it in the video as it wobbles about in the tank I think. 

Edited by Caffeinated_fiend
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6 minutes ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

pressure is lower with VST

grind finer. But ultimately, don't worry about it. 

 

7 minutes ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

I am using Tesco Ashbeck water but I put the Lelit filter in as wel

I doubt the filter has any benefit in that case. 

Current: Lelit Elizabeth / Niche Zero / VST baskets / Distilled water + 100mg NaCO3/L

Previous: Gaggia Classic | Eureka Mignon | Rocket Cellini Evo | Profitec 700 | Profitec T-64 | Gene Cafe CBR-101 | Kinu M68 | Feldgrind 2 | La Pavoni Europiccola 2012

Also at: CoffeeTime Forum & Niche Zero Owners Group

 

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I need to get a bottomless portafilter as my next purchase, I have noticed on my pucks that with the OEM I always seem to have a little dot in the middle that I’m guessing is channeling that isn’t there with the VST. 
 

I’m distributing from the niche, tapping it level and giving it a tap on the tamping mat to get rid of any air pockets. Next I’m using a distribution tool to get a level surface and then tamping. 

F9F11ED7-F8E7-42B9-A0C4-B00D889B8319.jpeg

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Dose 18g of coffee into the VST and you'll be fine. Remember, when the shot finishes, the puck is sucked back up and will collide with the shower screen. If it tastes good, then happy days. But yes, a bottomless is handy for diagnostics and to keep things clean afterwards. 

42 minutes ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

I pulled a shot without the filter

I have no idea what this means (presumably without the shower screen?). And, as I said many times before, ignore the pressure for the moment and focus on what matters. You are chasing unicorns. Different flows = different pressures. The pressure will go as high as the OPV with a blind basket. When there's flow of coffee, pressure will start declining. It's just natural, as explained before. 

For your own sanity, I will not comment on your "pressure" questions anymore 🙂  - Happy to help with everything else 👍

Current: Lelit Elizabeth / Niche Zero / VST baskets / Distilled water + 100mg NaCO3/L

Previous: Gaggia Classic | Eureka Mignon | Rocket Cellini Evo | Profitec 700 | Profitec T-64 | Gene Cafe CBR-101 | Kinu M68 | Feldgrind 2 | La Pavoni Europiccola 2012

Also at: CoffeeTime Forum & Niche Zero Owners Group

 

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2 hours ago, MediumRoastSteam said:

Dose 18g of coffee into the VST and you'll be fine. Remember, when the shot finishes, the puck is sucked back up and will collide with the shower screen. If it tastes good, then happy days. But yes, a bottomless is handy for diagnostics and to keep things clean afterwards. 

I have no idea what this means (presumably without the shower screen?). And, as I said many times before, ignore the pressure for the moment and focus on what matters. You are chasing unicorns. Different flows = different pressures. The pressure will go as high as the OPV with a blind basket. When there's flow of coffee, pressure will start declining. It's just natural, as explained before. 

For your own sanity, I will not comment on your "pressure" questions anymore 🙂  - Happy to help with everything else 👍

What I meant is that I removed the Lelit Filter from inside the tank and put back the little filter back on. If you remember I lost almost all pressure when I installed it and I think it was due to a kink in the tube despite not seeing one. 
 

I have ordered the walnut bottomless so that will be interesting and potentially messy. 

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Had a play around with some preinfusion this morning on the VST using a light roast, set the Elizabeth to 95c and pulled the first one without pre-infusion and it came out at 26 seconds for about 38g in the cup. Had this as an Americano and it was good, orange and walnut tasting notes and it was big orange flavour in the cup.

Second drink I tested with a 7 second pre-infusion, 3 at the pump 4s steam. Same 18g dose and same grind to get a ballpark for the speed, 20s for my target weight of 36g. I went two dots finer on the niche and got my 38g out in 29s. 
 

Its a whole different look using the VST baskets, they really do speed up especially when you add pre-infusion into the mix. Once the pump kicked its it was trickling out and then it was up to around 2gs coming out. I made this into a latte which I don’t normally have but the steamer is so much fun on this machine and I can make some incredible milk compared to my barista pro. The drink also tasted good, the light roast couldn’t really put a dent into the traditional latte sweet milk taste however. 
 

Also as Dave pointed out in his review, he thought that 16g was a good dose for the OEM basket and when I dosed that this morning on some older grounds to practise my distribution I had no pin holes in the coffee, just a little shower screen indentation. 

Edited by Caffeinated_fiend
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Good morning, does this look underdosed? I have some Rave fudge blend that I am using at the moment, I am dosing around 16.1 into the Niche using the standard Lelit basket, I was going to use the VST but I worried it would be very easy to over-extract with that.  
 

Amazon lost my Bottomless portafilter and to be honest using that will hopefully be a good indicator of if it is channeling. It tasted ok but I’m at a reduced tasting ability as the kids going back to school has given us all tonsillitis from the same cold. Kids who’d av em.

 

2EEEF45A-6507-4B67-A1F7-1135987CA11B.jpeg

Edited by Caffeinated_fiend
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@Caffeinated_fiend - That doesn't look good. Feels to me you have too little coffee in the basket. 

Current: Lelit Elizabeth / Niche Zero / VST baskets / Distilled water + 100mg NaCO3/L

Previous: Gaggia Classic | Eureka Mignon | Rocket Cellini Evo | Profitec 700 | Profitec T-64 | Gene Cafe CBR-101 | Kinu M68 | Feldgrind 2 | La Pavoni Europiccola 2012

Also at: CoffeeTime Forum & Niche Zero Owners Group

 

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10 minutes ago, MediumRoastSteam said:

@Caffeinated_fiend - That doesn't look good. Feels to me you have too little coffee in the basket. 

Is there a good rule of thumb with regards to dose between roast types? What’s the optimum way to assess dose in the basket?
 

Is it just the basket in that it has a wider tolerance compared to a VST which is 1g either way. 

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13 minutes ago, Caffeinated_fiend said:

Is there a good rule of thumb with regards to dose between roast types? What’s the optimum way to assess dose in the basket?
 

Is it just the basket in that it has a wider tolerance compared to a VST which is 1g either way. 

https://www.home-barista.com/tips/what-correct-dose-for-my-basket-t20855.html

Current: Lelit Elizabeth / Niche Zero / VST baskets / Distilled water + 100mg NaCO3/L

Previous: Gaggia Classic | Eureka Mignon | Rocket Cellini Evo | Profitec 700 | Profitec T-64 | Gene Cafe CBR-101 | Kinu M68 | Feldgrind 2 | La Pavoni Europiccola 2012

Also at: CoffeeTime Forum & Niche Zero Owners Group

 

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