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A word of caution for Osmio/RO users


TomHughes
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is it realistic to expect the majority of minerals in your diet to be coming from drinking tap water?  where does that leave people in soft water areas?

ditto acidity, i believe @DavecUK said in his review that it became slightly acidic after standing for a while and absoring CO2 from the atmosphere, about the same acidity as milk.  i drink orange juice, milk, and coke on occasion, i can't believe that ever so slightly acidic water instead of tap water is going to cause a huge difference to my teeth, or anything else.

the flouride thing, that i can believe.  if you have sensitive teeth (i do), then you need the flouride to help desensitise your teeth.  i had to use high-flouride (prescription only) toothpaste for a while, i'm on 'normal' sensitive toothpaste at the moment.  perhaps if you were right on the edge then the lack of flouride in the water has tipped you over.

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Another word of caution.

Long term tests need to be looked at on the possible reasons affecting fast tooth enamel breakdown.

I am not disagreeing with the prognosis, but as a retired scientific researcher I am wary of one dentist's opinion without the full evidence shown of the meta analysis undertaken, showing the statistical probabilities of the results.

Edited by ratty
for clarity
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I'm not a believer of the RO/DI water is bad for you ideas (based on lack of minerals). As facboy above, the minerals from drinking water are low, not to mention hugely variable in different areas. You will get most of the minerals you need from food you eat, the amount from drinking water (at least in my case) is very low; e.g Calcium in water contributes about 150-200mg a day of a 1000mg RDA.

The issue here is the lack of fluoride in the water for people who need additional fluoride. Bottled water or tap water without fluoride would have caused the same problem. There may have been a slight decrease in PH caused by drinking more water than usual (replacing saliva with water) which can lead to bad bacteria growth which attacks enamel. The RO from the Osmio is remineralised to be about the same as Ashbeck in terms of minerals I think, at least according to GH:KH tests somebody did (don't take my word for it, test it yourself because I'm vaguely remembering things I've been told).

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1 hour ago, Rob1 said:

I'm not a believer of the RO/DI water is bad for you ideas (based on lack of minerals). As facboy above, the minerals from drinking water are low, not to mention hugely variable in different areas. You will get most of the minerals you need from food you eat, the amount from drinking water (at least in my case) is very low; e.g Calcium in water contributes about 150-200mg a day of a 1000mg RDA.

The issue here is the lack of fluoride in the water for people who need additional fluoride. Bottled water or tap water without fluoride would have caused the same problem. There may have been a slight decrease in PH caused by drinking more water than usual (replacing saliva with water) which can lead to bad bacteria growth which attacks enamel. The RO from the Osmio is remineralised to be about the same as Ashbeck in terms of minerals I think, at least according to GH:KH tests somebody did (don't take my word for it, test it yourself because I'm vaguely remembering things I've been told).

I think you're right, there is definitely more to this. 
I think in my case I needed that little bit of fluoride to keep things stable. 

I probably drink more each day that a family combined as I spend upwards of 3-4 hours training, so will easily go through a hefty amount of water. For reference the Osmio is re-filled 4-5 times a day. And it's only really me at home! 

 

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4 minutes ago, TomHughes said:

I think you're right, there is definitely more to this. 
I think in my case I needed that little bit of fluoride to keep things stable. 

I probably drink more each day that a family combined as I spend upwards of 3-4 hours training, so will easily go through a hefty amount of water. For reference the Osmio is re-filled 4-5 times a day. And it's only really me at home! 

 

Maybe replace some of that water with tea!

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4 hours ago, beanere2long said:

This is a bit concerning as a new owner of an Osmio!? I wonder what they’d say to this?

My personal thoughts as they apply to me and my family

Not all water in the UK has fluoride added (also the evidence is mixed, rather than unequivocal as to how effective adding fluoride to water has been) Indeed there is a good chance your water authority adds no fluoride...you can look it up. Hull for example have resisted it for decades.

I use a fluoride toothpaste and don't rinse my mouth afterward (my dentist told me that years ago and it's great advice for me). It works very well to deliver fluoride to the tooth enamel and ensures you are actually brushing your teeth well twice a day and not rinsing it all away before it has a chance to take effect. Long ago toothpaste had no fluoride added and when it did, people were rubbish at regularly brushing their teeth.

Don't brush my teeth within 30m of eating was mentioned by someone...that's fantastic advice. I knew a girl with lovely white teeth who brushed them immediately after eating anything....she wore the enamel away because it's softer after eating (again my dentist supported this view and advises waiting at least 30m or longer before brushing)

 

Sticks and Stones, sours…or rancid (horrible). Quakers hide until roasted, pick em out and flick them in the bin. Life is too short for bad coffee

 

 

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16 minutes ago, beanere2long said:

Ok panic over. I guess reading the initial post coincided with me thinking I’m still yet to get used to the new taste of water through the osmio. I do remember reading various things over the years about fluoride in water supply but don’t have a particular view either way to be honest. 

 

Well, the cause of Tom's dental distress hasn't been proven or not so I'd say you would be wise to be cautious.

If I may speculate:

RO water is nasty stuff. It's an industrial treatment whose products are not meant for domestic use. RO water is harmful to man and machine. I've said before on this forum that I don't feel it's something to be used lightly in a domestic environment.

Tom's dentist agrees.

 

But, perhaps something else is at hand here?

Tom isn't of course, using RO water at all. He is using treated water of which RO is just one of the processes.

If Tom's dentist is under the impression he is using pure RO water, then he's correct in his diagnosis.

I am hoping that the Osmio or its processes, re-mineralises the  RO water prior to consumption. I read that this can be done a number of ways but have no idea what Tom's system is using.

Perhaps this re-mineralization  has failed in some manner in Toms water and he really is drinking RO water?!

I hope not and hopefully Tom's distress is something else.

I wouldn't dismiss the symptoms though. Something has caused the issue.

I think personally, the flouride is a red herring.

Hope it's clears up soon Tom.

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@Blue_Cafe

Welcome back after a short absence....still talking the usual unsupported waffle I see.....

In a race between a donkey and a horse, to see who could reach the bottom first..........one side has a commanding lead

 

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16 minutes ago, Blue_Cafe said:

Which bit is waffle?

errrr....All of it....substitute waffle for opinion....same thing

In a race between a donkey and a horse, to see who could reach the bottom first..........one side has a commanding lead

 

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1 minute ago, Blue_Cafe said:

I love you too. 😘

You learn fast.....LOL

I think the moral of this story, is that you cannot judge anything based on the experiences of one person. He is absolutely right to bring it to our attention but I doubt it is worth losing any sleep over.....science is not based on one opinion spouted by somebody who may or mayn't be right or wrong 

In a race between a donkey and a horse, to see who could reach the bottom first..........one side has a commanding lead

 

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Just now, dfk41 said:

You learn fast.....LOL

I think the moral of this story, is that you cannot judge anything based on the experiences of one person. He is absolutely right to bring it to our attention but I doubt it is worth losing any sleep over.....science is not based on one opinion spouted by somebody who may or mayn't be right or wrong 

And as usual, i have no idea what you are talking about 👍

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5 hours ago, TomHughes said:

I think you're right, there is definitely more to this. 
I think in my case I needed that little bit of fluoride to keep things stable. 

I probably drink more each day that a family combined as I spend upwards of 3-4 hours training, so will easily go through a hefty amount of water. For reference the Osmio is re-filled 4-5 times a day. And it's only really me at home! 

 

Tom. I noticed you mentioned drinking during training are you adding anything into the water perhaps looking for isotonic benefits. I ask as when exercising heavily years ago it was common for people to try adding things for better hydration or indeed carbohydrates for maintaining energy. Sipping often small amounts would probably have a negative affect on your teeth and possibly generate higher saliva output

I use in addition to others recommendations fluoride mouthwash. Good luck   

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