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dfk41

Trump or Biden?

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What an absolutely horrible choice to have to make, indeed as was Trump or Clinton! We have not discussed American politics much on here so let us try. I am not really interested in your personal view on either candidate but your thoughts that this appears to be the binary choice for millions in November. Biden is the new kid on the block. Trump has a 4 year record to analyse. If we thing politics and Brexit have made this country divisive then America takes things to a whole new level.

SO, the question is, you only have one vote......who gets it? AS I said, please think about this rather than just say I hate Trump so Biden wins......do you really think taking personality out of it, that Biden might do a better job......personally, I thank my lucky stars for not being an American living in America right now!


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Trump again.

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The president of the US is not his own man, he either follows willingly or is dragged along reluctantly. To his credit and unlike his predecessors, Trump has not started any wars. Biden went willingly (and for personal financial gain)along with destabilising Ukraine to get at RF. Dangerous times ahead for everybody as the US empire collapses. 

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This should escalate quickly....

Please be mindful of our US members. It might be enlightening to hear their (rational) perspectives?

I do think it most likely that Trump will win, but I  doubt it will be well received.

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It's an almost impossible choice. If it had been Cuomo v Trump it would have been easy. Cuomo every time. As it is, you're not really voting for Biden, he's unlikely to survive even one term, you're voting for his vice-president, whoever that may be. 
To answer the original question, it would have to be Biden.


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After four years of Trump - the best the Democrats could come up with is sleep Joe Biden who is quite probably in the early stages of dementia/Alzheimer's.  If he is, how on earth is he going to fulfill his duties as president - remember, the president has his or her finger on the nuclear button. I foresee him being president in name only whilst the power of office is in the hands of the unelected. 

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17 minutes ago, The Systemic Kid said:

 I foresee him being president in name only whilst the power of office is in the hands of the unelected. 

OK, but how does that relate any more/less to Biden than any other president, seeing as they have to get agreement in congress, with state governers & city mayors/councils in any case?

Of course, these people are also elected at regional level.

Lots of countries have nuclear buttons, are they all as transparent & judicious as the US?


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5 minutes ago, Blue_Cafe said:

I can't understand why the Dems put Biden on the ticket.

,

High recognition amongst voters, infighting & dirty tricks within the party discrediting other nominees.


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I think this is going to be another Trump/Brexit where the woke left will be left scratching their heads after their plan of calling people racist etc didn't win voters over. 

The current media would lead you to believe that everyone is woke and the world hates Trump but the truth is that people are just scared to speak out against the current zeitgeist out of fear for their jobs and general backlash. A hell of a lot of people still support Trump and you don't have to tell anyone who you voted for. 

Even if he loses I think it will be a lot closer than people think. 

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8 minutes ago, mctrials23 said:

I think this is going to be another Trump/Brexit where the woke left will be left scratching their heads after their plan of calling people racist etc didn't win voters over. 

The current media would lead you to believe that everyone is woke and the world hates Trump but the truth is that people are just scared to speak out against the current zeitgeist out of fear for their jobs and general backlash. A hell of a lot of people still support Trump and you don't have to tell anyone who you voted for. 

Even if he loses I think it will be a lot closer than people think. 

Bang on.

I kinda think that the Dems don't actually want to win it (see @MWJB 's post above)

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Posted (edited)

Our perspective is going to be radically different to those actually living in the USA.

My American friends are concerned around access to abortion, actually being able to vote ( see GOP voter suppression tactics ) . They have massive concerns about systemic racism and climate change. They fear what is a poor medical system , becoming unaffordable and unuseable for anyone with a pre existing condition , including  anything  left by COVID ) . They tire of a lack of ambition to bring in gun control and fear the division that grows between neighbour with each passing tweet. 

Politicians are always beholden to someone, And the American system is the worst and monies influencing it .  Trump to Big Corps and the Evangelicals. Democrats are equally beholden to The Big Corps that support election spending .

Why did Biden win the nomination, Big Money versus Small donation , Big money feared losing its influence . Fear of change. You get the socialism / communism smears at Sanders. Yet Obamacare, and food stamps, aid for farmers are all popular concepts. 

Has anyone watched a live Press trump conference /briefing recently , he is truly incoherent most of the time. 

What the people I talk to in the states really want is someone who wants and can lead.To them this is not Trump. They are scared where the Covid response will take the country. 

To those in this thread that said Trump , I am genuinely interested from the outside what they think he has done, is doing that makes them think he would be a good choice for the USA and the rest of the world. Not how Bad Biden is ( he doesn’t inspire me ) but what has Trump been good at ? 

 

Edited by Mrboots2u
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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Blue_Cafe said:

Trump.

The era of the polished politician is dead.

Absolutely and Boris is paving the way with that :)

What’s the phrase , you can’t polish a  Boris...

 Trump  gives cover for how useless Boris is , ill give you that.

Edited by Mrboots2u

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6 minutes ago, Mrboots2u said:

They fear what is a poor medical system , becoming unaffordable and unuseable for anyone with a pre existing condition , including  anything  left by COVID ) . 

 

I understand the affordability issue, but the American healthcare is better than the UK's in many respects, including survivability of heart disease, stroke, some cancers.

What would be the tax implications for the US to adopt Biden's healthcare plan at $2.25 trillion (I don't even know how many noughts to add on that) over 10yrs.

On the surface the healthcare issue looks simple, democrats want the government to control it, republicans think it should be largely in the private sector...but do democrat voters really want the taxes it would cause?


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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, The Systemic Kid said:

After four years of Trump - the best the Democrats could come up with is sleep Joe Biden who is quite probably in the early stages of dementia/Alzheimer's.  If he is, how on earth is he going to fulfill his duties as president - remember, the president has his or her finger on the nuclear button. I foresee him being president in name only whilst the power of office is in the hands of the unelected. 

And Trump isn’t? 

Edited by Mrboots2u

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Just now, MWJB said:

I understand the affordability issue, but the American healthcare is better than the UK's in many respects, including survivability of heart disease, stroke, some cancers.

What would be the tax implications for the US to adopt Biden's healthcare plan at $2.25 trillion (I don't even know how many noughts to add on that) over 10yrs.

On the surface the healthcare issue looks simple, democrats want the government to control it, republicans think it should be largely in the private sector...but do democrat voters really want the taxes it would cause?

It’s better if you have money and or insurance or a job.  

I don’t think any party in the USA would be called deficit hawks, if you look at recent history the Dems have a better record of deficit reduction than the GOP. Money was found to run up a massive tax cut for corporations that simply went into stock buy back. 

Neither candidate seems to have the appetite to tackle the issues of Big Pharma and drug prices either.


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5 hours ago, dfk41 said:

Biden is the new kid on the block.

Hardly. He's already failed twice! 

The democrats inability to put forward good candidates is largely their demise.  Hilary Clinton was an absolute train wreck. 

I think Trump will win. Like him or loath him, he was true to his previous manifesto. I'm categorically not wanting to get onto the BLM thing in this thread but I do think it will help his campaign immensely. When people feel law and order is in danger of being compromised, they will lean towards voting republican. 

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6 minutes ago, Rapid said:

Hardly. He's already failed twice! 

The democrats inability to put forward good candidates is largely their demise.  Hilary Clinton was an absolute train wreck. 

I think Trump will win. Like him or loath him, he was true to his previous manifesto. I'm categorically not wanting to get onto the BLM thing in this thread but I do think it will help his campaign immensely. When people feel law and order is in danger of being compromised, they will lean towards voting republican. 

He got Mexico to pay for the wall that got built

Repealed and replaced Obamacare 

The promised 3 % growth pre Covid 

His tax cuts  paid for themselves and didnt increase the deficit 

 

 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, MWJB said:

I understand the affordability issue, but the American healthcare is better than the UK's in many respects, including survivability of heart disease, stroke, some cancers.

What would be the tax implications for the US to adopt Biden's healthcare plan at $2.25 trillion (I don't even know how many noughts to add on that) over 10yrs.

On the surface the healthcare issue looks simple, democrats want the government to control it, republicans think it should be largely in the private sector...but do democrat voters really want the taxes it would cause?

Sorry meant poor in terms of accessibility as opposed to quality of care. 


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9 minutes ago, Mrboots2u said:

He got Mexico to pay for the wall that got built

Repealed and replaced Obamacare 

The promised 3 % growth pre Covid 

His tax cuts  paid for themselves and didnt increase the deficit 

My motto - Trump is good for America but bad for the rest of the world. I completely understand why they voted him in and likewise to re-electing him. 

There's a common sense on entitlement across the world that America somehow owes everyone else something. They don't. They've just previously took it upon themselves to playing an admirable role in shaping the free world. This of cause is to be lauded but there comes a point where forgetting about your own citizens cannot be ignored forever. 

The economy is the cornerstone of every nation. Having a business man in charge is a smart move in my opinion (although I dislike the presidential system). Their economy was always going to thrive with him changing policies to suit them rather than everyone else. 

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Odds via Betfair are Biden 1.61 to 1 with Trump 2.68 to 1 so sounds like a lot on here are going to make a pretty penny.

 


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3 minutes ago, Rapid said:

My motto - Trump is good for America but bad for the rest of the world. I completely understand why they voted him in and likewise to re-electing him. 

There's a common sense on entitlement across the world that America somehow owes everyone else something. They don't. They've just previously took it upon themselves to playing an admirable role in shaping the free world. This of cause is to be lauded but there comes a point where forgetting about your own citizens cannot be ignored forever. 

The economy is the cornerstone of every nation. Having a business man in charge is a smart move in my opinion (although I dislike the presidential system). Their economy was always going to thrive with him changing policies to suit them rather than everyone else. 

 

The economy was thriving before he got there , he didn’t pull it put of recession. 

A business man who failed at making money from a casino has a very special talent for business. 

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4 minutes ago, Stevebee said:

Odds via Betfair are Biden 1.61 to 1 with Trump 2.68 to 1 so sounds like a lot on here are going to make a pretty penny.

 

What were the odds on remain vs leave? 😉

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3 minutes ago, Rapid said:

What were the odds on remain vs leave? 😉

Not as wide as that


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