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Caffeine in espresso (aka, no stupid questions)


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Posted (edited)

I received my Decent Espresso machine last week and I've been tinkering ever since. I was telling my brother about this, and I told him it was great but my caffeine consumption had drastically increases: instead of 15g on my La Pav I was dosing 19g on the Decent and so at a 1:2 ratio I was getting roughly 25% more caffeine. 

He doubted this was true. He cited limits to extraction. I said I doubted that to be true. I thought it might be true if you crammed 19g into the same size basket as a 15g (somehow), but with the greater surface area of a 58mm portafilter vs a 48mm, there was undoubtedly extraction that was great on a directly proportional basis.

So: is there more caffeine in a 1:2 shot of 19g beans as against 15g beans? 

Edited by filthynines

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, filthynines said:

I received my Decent Espresso machine last week and I've been tinkering ever since. I was telling my brother about this, and I told him it was great but my caffeine consumption had drastically increases: instead of 15g on my La Pav I was dosing 19g on the Decent and so at a 1:2 ratio I was getting roughly 25% more caffeine. 

He doubted this was true. He cited limits to extraction. I said I doubted that to be true. I thought it might be true if you crammed 19g into the same size basket as a 15g (somehow), but with the greater surface area of a 58mm portafilter vs a 48mm, there was undoubtedly extraction that was great on a directly proportional basis.

So: is there more caffeine in a 1:2 shot of 19g beans as against 15g beans? 

As far as I’m aware caffeine is pretty much the most soluble compound in coffee, so is almost entirely extracted almost within the first water contact.

Therefore unless your grind is super coarse the caffeine content is entirely dictated by dose in grams 

edit OR your channeling is so bad you have areas of dry coffee 

Edited by TomHughes
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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, TomHughes said:

As far as I’m aware caffeine is pretty much the most soluble compound in coffee, so is almost entirely extracted almost within the first water contact.

Therefore unless your grind is super coarse the caffeine content is entirely dictated by dose in grams 

Now that's what I would have said, but not quite as succinctly put as you have. Let's see if anybody tells us we're wrong...

Edited by filthynines
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Limits to extraction would only really apply if you were trying to increase the yield from the same dose, so moving from say a 1:2 ratio from a 15g dose to 1:3 from 15g the difference in caffeine would be minimal. When you up the dose and keep the same ratio there would be more caffeine as there's theoretically more caffeine there to be extracted in the first place. 

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Arabica beans would give you roughly about 300 mg in 19 g dose. The solubility of caffeine as Tom mentioned is very high at water temperature near boiling so yes, the more coffee (given the same grinding size) you put the more caffeine you get out. 

I have experienced this myself moving from 14-15 g to 19 g.  Two of these per day and sometimes I feel a bit dizzy. 

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1 hour ago, John Yossarian said:

Arabica beans would give you roughly about 300 mg in 19 g dose.

Caffeine content of Arabica is usually reported as being in the region of 1.1 to 1.3%.

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46 minutes ago, MWJB said:

Caffeine content of Arabica is usually reported as being in the region of 1.1 to 1.3%.

So I guess that’s where the 80mg in espresso comes from, 80mg in an ‘Italian single of 7-8g. ? 
 

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3 minutes ago, TomHughes said:

So I guess that’s where the 80mg in espresso comes from, 80mg in an ‘Italian single of 7-8g. ? 
 

Sure, that's my reading of it.

“Coffee evokes the most insane reactions in people”, Rene Redzepi.

 

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, MWJB said:

Caffeine content of Arabica is usually reported as being in the region of 1.1 to 1.3%.

I got the data from here,

https://myfriendscoffee.com/how-much-caffeine-in-a-coffee-bean/

1.2-1.5% which is around 0.3 g for 19 g beans.

Edited by John Yossarian
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ACS Vesuvius, Nuova Simonelli Apia I 1 gr, San Remo 1 gr., Bezzera BZ35e, Fracino Heavenly, Saeco Via Veneto Combi de Luxe, Mythos Plus Nuova Simonelli, Anfim Super Lusso, Cunill Space, Gene Cafe

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