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Ed from MK

Magnifica S 22.360.S Leaks

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Hello All,

I hope i can get some advice here.

I am definitely NOT as much as you lot are Coffee officianado's, as i have been reading here for a while,

but i DO like a decent coffee ..I have been through all the usual stages of progression and finally ended up with a DeLonghi Magnifica S about 3 years ago 

...i know, i know its not the choice of the "pros" ..but for me it was the best coffee I had ever tasted ...and so i fell in love, and it was NOT cheap.

I only REALLY use it for making double espressos in the morning ...period. I have lots of stove tops espresso and I also have a Bialetti Mokono which for some reason
makes really gritty coffee and on occasion it literally BLOWS the cup arm off ..so not good. So the Magnifica was my default

About 6 months ago ...the machine started making really SMALL cups and also i noticed water int he drip tray which would overflow after a while. 

Now it has finally stopped depositing coffee.. So i looked at it with the tray out and what is happening is there is a LITTLE red block under the front left that deLonghi refers to as a "condensate tray" its small like a little hollow lego brick ...anyway when i remove this and try and make my shots a DUAL stream of water comes down onto the counter, a lot to be honest ...its clean hot water and thats what is filling the tray...Any Ideas ? ..

I have of course descaled and cleaned the infuser and stuff and rinsed and even poked the old toothpicks up the spouts ..but no joy 

 

Could it be a blockage somewhere internal ? is there a common fix ?

 

Any help is appreciated 

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Not sure on the machine but sounds like a stuck solenoid. Have a look on google and see if there is a solenoid on the machine and where it is located in your machine.

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Will do thanks ....Only just able to do that as i tried to dismantle but only got so far and had to order special Torx driver bits
ebay sorted it out ..so I will get stuck in there today  ..it all in bits in the ute room and the wife is crying like Gazza LOL

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Well Cooffe, 

I did as you suggested and I have some piccies!
I think this machine (particular model) is a bit neglected in online help guides, and so i may even make one on assembly and re-assembly,
to see if it would help others.

Well i got it partially stripped, only to the point i can SEE all the guts, I am no expert here ..but was always good with car engines (does that help..
..i fear not)

anyway there are 13 pics attached (bad omen maybe) ..if you look,  I have put little yellow numbers on them.

Not wanting to get involved in the electric bits (as I am no good with them) best advice to anyone trying this is UNPLUG ..you have to plug it in to test stuff and see for a blockage, but there is so MANY wires and connectors on this beast ....and u dont want to have your hands close if its got power to it 

So i tried to follow the flow of hot water / and hopefully coffee ! . I did this by inserting the water container, infuser and drain tray after it was stripped so it would fire up ....then i put in some of my beans and turned her on ....Went through the motions fine and then, as usual the hot water just came out of that encrusted spout (visible in 5)..i have cleaned it now ofc.

So i  followed it and it seems to be some type of spillover plastic chamber ...Pic 8 is a good example/ there appears to be lots of pipes that end up there...i mean i KNOW that a teeny weeny red condensate cup sits under the machine ....so i am presuming that its just some condensate drip ...and so not sure why it has a large black chamber if it is only expected to fill a 15ml receptacle ..mysterious ...

Its safe to say there are i suppose 3 types of plastic tubing in this machine ....some thick ones say ...8-10mm and then there are quite a few clear rubber/plastic ones 5-8mm and of course the thinner more rigid ones, If i am guessing and watching the liquid in the tubes right, the larger ones are water and the small ones deliver coffee (or they should)

What I CAN tell you is that when you attempt to make a cup ...there is NO sign of movement or pressure or anything in these SMALLER tubes ...which leads me to think something is stuck somewhere (or blocked)

There is is a few points where several tubes and wires converge into what look like valves (solenoid switches?) ..Looking about i can identify 3 of these places inside which could house some sort of switch ...but by FAR the most obvious is the one in pictures 10,11.12 and 13 ..It looks like a lot depends on that one

What do you lot think. any advice is appreciated 

 

Eddie


 

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Edited by Ed from MK

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Ah..I am guessing this is it here ?

https://www.4delonghi.co.uk/solenoid-valve-ceme-5301vn2/product.pl?pid=2792968

So not too bad at £16 ....but I am thinking ...While i have it in bits ...What else COULD i service.
Is there anything else i could buy that i could replace ....just to be sure? ....rings, seals, tubes, even another of these
SPOOKY mini-solenoids? in there (although i cant find much info on them )?

 

Just want to future-proof myself

Edited by Ed from MK

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Can you tell if the pump is working as well? Just to be sure it’s not pumping incorrectly. I’d suggest on the thick clear pipes to disconnect and clean out with a pipe brush as gunk can build up in them. 

The smaller ones look a bit gunked up too with coffee residue - see picture 12. I’d suggest unclipping them and giving them a good clean too if you can get a pipe brush small enough. 

If you can get the solenoid out and pull it apart then check the little flow holes that direct the water, some scale may be blocking them and preventing flow.

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Thanks Coofe,

 

I will deffo clean that pesky devil out...when you say Pump ...I can see 2 things in there that appear to work in tandem ...

1. is what looks like a long stepper-motor ....but it might not be ...bottom left in Picture 8 ??

2. just up from that is what looks like a brake pressure housing ....they used to be in older cars and had the mater cylinder attached.

Do you know what they are..I bet you do :)

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@Ed from MK fairly sure the pump is the part that has the sticker on in picture 3. The thing you say looks like a brake pressure housing I think is a flow meter (are you talking about the white thing on the right on picture 1?) and the cylindrical tube is a infuser of some sort I think - don’t quote me on that though.

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@Ed from MK I would also suggest turning the machine on and feeling the solenoid valve and running water through the steamwand, and then try to run it through the grouphead. Put your hand in the solenoid and you should feel it switch or move inside. 

Would also suggest backflushing a few times to try and move some gunk out of pipes... try the solenoid thing first though as you have it to bits anyway

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Sorry Cooffe

 

by the time i read this i had already took it off :(

more special spline screws ..thankfully got a decent set of ebay for £5.

Well i got the solenoid out and separated the little white ...well, manifold i suppose.

I also disconnected most of the stiff narrow tubes and blew dont them to see if they were block ...none were.

I cleaned the manifold after these photos ...but to be honest it wasn't blocked at all and i could easily blow through all holes.

Regarding the actual solenoid piston ..it is only sat in there and on a week spring and it easily comes in and out manually with no resitance,

whether the relay is driving it ..is another question ..I will have to connect it at least back together enough to test it.

While i was poking about tin there i noticed ANOTHER solenoid/relay at the bottom of the machine and wondered do THESE ever go ?

On the solenoid and relay i did dismantle too ..i can see some ..we ll i will call it electric "browning" on one of the connectors

you know the sort you get with heat or when something burns out 

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@Ed from MK does that pipe with red lagging on picture 5 (top left on picture 4) go into the moulding that has the coffee encrusted stuff on it? Does it also connect to the module with the burnt out connector on? Not 100% sure what this is - is it something to do with the milk?

 

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8 hours ago, Cooffe said:

@Ed from MK does that pipe with red lagging on picture 5 (top left on picture 4) go into the moulding that has the coffee encrusted stuff on it? Does it also connect to the module with the burnt out connector on? Not 100% sure what this is - is it something to do with the milk?

 

I shall investigate and report back.

I confess i do not use the milk facility on this machine at all

or VERY rarely.

In summer you have to literally scrub it out and flush it every time or else it smells a bit
and so its too much for me 

If I want a latte (well my version anyway) I always do the same thing

half coffee cup with skimmed milk in microwave 1:30
then drop one or 2 shots in it when it comes out as required

 

ofc i do LOVE the look of a frothy top...but i am a coffee follower porimarily for taste and so I am looking for 
a machine that gives me a good creamy smooth expresso. Right now i am grinding my blend with my bodum nice and fine
and winding it up into a bialetti pressure jobbie ...BOOM lovely...if not a little TOO nice and strong :)

 

I just miss the convenince of my magnifica ...fill it with beans and water and u can have a DECENT espresso shot 
(not as good as the bialetti ofc) but u can leave it AS IS for a few days 

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Ok

 

I have some MORE pics!

In answer to your questions buddy.

the Red coated thick black pipe does indeed seem to empty into that receptacle / condensate.

but then it looks like a FEW things do ..not sure why.

the catch tray under it is REALLY tiny red thing ..i mean tiny as in quarter the size of a matchbox !
so its obviously something that is hardly ever to be used

i did look at the milk side of things and the ONLY connection i can see between the milk receptacle at the
front and inner workings is a tiny hole that the 2 oringed SPIGOT that protrudes from  the milk container pushes into when its on there 

i dismantled this bit and it LOOKS like a plastic square with an o ring within it ..there is some wires also ...not sure how they interact
i cant see room for a valve or solenoid or anything ..perhaps a sensor or something

 

<sigh> ..its complicated!

 

i do know for sure that what leaks out is water, not milk ..and also while the water can APPEAR a bit murky,
it is not dark enough (i think) to be an expulsion of coffee ..which i think would be a LOT darker ...or we would hope :)

 

one of the clear flexible pipe connections at the back of this has a strange "metal pipe and wire" at the back of it..looks like it COULD
be a sensor of sorts this sits on top of a circular black unit that looks like the top of a turbo *(that type of shape) 

could this be something that pumps and circulates a suction needed for milk ?..i dont know why ..but i am of an opinion that 
milk NEVER enters the machine at all ..would that be the case?

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Thanks Cooffe, 

sorry for late reply .
Ye the clear (narrower one?) does indeed go to a solenoid ....not the one i have removed , but that one at the BOTTOM of the machine..

if you look at the image below you can see it "lurking" and you can see the tube entering it.(pic 1 below)

The OTHER tube you marked is an ENIGMA ...it goes behind a cowl and then ends up somewhere in the centre top (i think) 
you can't see bugger hall from the other side ....but if i POKE my camera in the slot at the top u can see SOME of the gubbins

That's the tube u can see on the far left ....and if you follow it it "appears to go into the large white plastic section int eh middle ...
of course thats a guess.

Just to clarify in the 2nd pic we are looking down the front of the unit and therefore that pipe u can see in the middle can ONLY
really be the one that delivers coffee to the 2 x spouts..thee spouts have some travel (as most do) and that channel allows the carriage
they are on to slide up and down a few inches

 

I am getting to the stage now where i have so many nuts and screws i may be unable to reassemble ...so now I am nervous 

 

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Edited by Ed from MK

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Hmm I still think it’s a blockage in a solenoid. And I am guessing that as the water ends up out of that plastic pipe bit with the encrusted coffee stuff that one of the clear pipes feeding into it must go back to a solenoid and have a blockage. 

I wouldnt want to recommend any more for fear of your inability to reassemble, but what you have describes is as would be expected with a faulty solenoid. Maybe that one with the burnt out connector needs replacing as the iron bar inside is no longer moving due to a faulty (burnt out) connector.

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thanks

none of the pipes i have seen (or blown through) seems to be blocked in any way

there is certainly not a pipe i can see that is clogged up visibly and so I too am guessing that 
the flow ..ends up at one of these solenoids (hopefully the 2 i can see and get to) and then something
"happens" that make them basically DUMP the water out to the condensate tray (albeit a tiny tray) via that 
plastic housing that

What i find strange is that IF that large-ish collection housing jobbie ONLY appears to exit to that weeny teeny condensate tray,
and indeed IF this housing takes so many FEEDS to it (presumably from other condensate drips or runoffs) then

1. why is it so TINY
2. why would the design not vent these "little drips" in the the run off tray that is in the bottom of EVERY machine and is more
than capable of handling it

it just makes no sense to me 

The only thing i can think of because its RED, it is meant to advise you of a fault further back in the supply chain and so technically it should
NEVER have water in it ...even though it only holds say 15ml (3 teaspoons tops)

NOT a great design if you ask me ! ..anyway i will try and get the serial number of the other lower solenoid today and trawl the t'interweb looking
for parts for them both ....better safe than sorry..I mean they COULD both be the same with only the placcy manifolds differing ? ..which would be nice
as i can just dismantle and clean these manifolds as they dont appear to have any springs or valves within at all (unless i am missing them)

I mean the solenoid i have taken apart so far just has a bar-valve and a weak sprint and it APPEARS to move in and out fine ....but of course that DOES
not mean it is actuating when it should electrically

I will get back to you cooffe, hopefully this will help others on here with similar machines and problems 

That being said whilst it has been in bits I have fallen back in love with my Bialetti Mokoma and my Bodum Grinder ..which while nowhere near as convenient
as the magnifica ....BUT produces a far better espresso shot ...albeit with all the usual cleaning the pressure strainer, refilling it and tamping down and grinding  etc
...such is life.

I just dont think i have seen a bean to cup solution that lives up to a decent PRESSURE style DIY like the Mokoma etc ...certainly not that i can afford anyway :)

 

 

Edited by Ed from MK

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Well i gave in to temptation and ordered 

BOTH those solenoids , they come with manifolds 

cost me £28 for the pair 

BOTTOM OF MACHINE IS: 5220VN2
TOP OF MACHINE IS: 5301VN2

these are the ONLY ones visible with the machine almost apart

if there is any more they will be WELL OUT OF REACH and possible almost UN-serviceable for the novice

fingers crossed 

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