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DavecUK

Reverse Osmosis - Osmio Zero review

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I was asked about the membrane and TDS levels etc.. recently and I realised that I may well have oversimplified things. So for those that re interested. An RO membrane (this is a coarse generalisation using TDS, which has it's own issues) usually filters to around 4 -10% of the TDS of the incoming water, sometimes less sometimes more. TDS is a crude measurement, because many other things it filters are not measurable by a TDS meter, also much dry residue is not measurable. However we have what we have in home measurement tech.

 

Today My input water measures almost 300. So I would expect a reading around 15-25 ish. indeed I would get this as I did when testing, but I need to make the point that's after emptying the internal storage tank and refilling from a freshly filled supply pitcher. Even more important is to do that refill twice before measuring. e.g. do it once, empty the internal tank by running Osmio with the lid lifted, so it doesn't refill. Take the almost full supply pitcher out empty it all and refill it....then refill the RO internal tank a second time. If you don't do this you get the higher TDS water from the membrane affecting the results (this higher TDS water came from filtering down the pitcher to the minimum as would have happened with normal use. The process is to get all this out or it affects the results. If it was as simply as bunging a TDS meter on there, it would have been easy to measure, but to do it right takes some time. Same with pH and it's a 24hr test as I said earlier.

 

Then be aware that as you use water the membrane is still only from say 4-10% efficient, but perversely as the TDS rises in the pitcher, it's able to actually achieve a better rejection %. The water saving nature of the Osmio Zero (one big reason I have it), means it recycles the water in the pitcher filtering the bejeesus out of it and the TDS in the pitcher continues to rise, and rise and rise...which is why you throw the last bit away before refilling, otherwise membrane life would shorten a lot. If you measure TDS as you get near the end of the pitcher, it's higher, because the water being filtered might have a TDS of 1000 or more! Take 4 or 5% of that ;)

 

So the water in the little RO storage tank will vary in TDS as it's always mixed with varying concentrations of TDS water from the membrane. You would probably actually get the lowest TDS measurement in normal usage at around the 3.5 litre mark on the supply pitcher (assuming you emptied and refilled completely each time) and importantly, unless you did the test properly as I did (stated earlier) you won't get the lowest TDS the system can provide. So in normal use as an average consider the TDS around 28 and the range from about 25-50 over time. Add in 20-40 from the remineralisation (my estimate, because that can vary on usage pattern) and we're probably running at an average TDS of 60, with a range between 48 - 80.

 

I hope this helps you guys understand the system a little better and also why I think the water is fine as it is from the Osmio and certainly backed up by pH testing (using the remineralisation cartridge) which gave 6.6 after 24 hours without necessarily needing any bicarb treatment.

 

Here is a photo of testing after 24 hours, using water from the Osmio near the top of it's cycle at around the 3.5 litre mark in the supply pitcher. The reason the TDS is lower there is my incoming water was around 270 TDS the day the sampling was done and the averages above are guestimates as your incoming TDS may be lower than mine.

 

osmio ph and tds.jpg

 

So I guess I didn't want to burden anyone with excessive detail before and I have tried to keep it to a very simple explanation...just in case people think a quick drip and dip will give valid measurements of system performance...it won't. It will simply give a snapshot in time reflecting usage patterns. Fortunately for us, those results are good for drinking and good for machines.

 

 

P.S. Sure if you did a minimum clean TDS test for membrane performance with the 2 fill method and then left it might go to 6.5 or even perhaps 6.4...but as I explained that doesn't happen in normal use and wouldn't be a problem even if it did.

 

P.P.S. The TDS reading of the remaining water in my Pitcher just before a water change actually goes off the scale of my meter and is 1000+ , so important to empty it out before refilling.


 My reviews at http://coffeestuff.byethost12.com/ (now ad free)  Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ (old site)

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Arrived today with extra set of filters, packed very well. I will set It up later. Thanks to Dave for bringing this neat unit to our attention.


Londinium I / Monolith Conical / Macap MC4 / Cormorant CR600 Roaster

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Problem with remineralization of a RO system is that it is not controlled, it goes all over the place when not used continuosly aka the water flow is constant.

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Guys.

Apart from looking good and convenience - what is the benefit of this over a standard RO system which can be picked up very cheaply - tks


Gaggia Classic : Vario : Espresso Gear Tamper

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Guys.

Apart from looking good and convenience - what is the benefit of this over a standard RO system which can be picked up very cheaply - tks

 

Have you actually read the review by DavecUK at least?

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^ yep have a read.


SAGE IS NOT A UPGRADE

 

 

:)

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Have you actually read the review by DavecUK at least?

 

Ashamedly I had not. I read the opening post last night.... got excited, went to the companies website - I missed Daves wiki review - now read :)

 

Very interesting product however not sure I would be able to justify it at that price point. The convenience is a huge plus, as is the on demand hot water.

 

However, the payback versus a more basic RO units is also up for debate. I kept marine fish and I have a 75gpd RODI unit that i estimated ran 1000 litres of water at 0TDS - from memory the unit was about £80 (plus £20 for some attachments) - my loss ratio was something like 1:5 - so 12,000 litre @ £3 a cubic meter

 

If i let the TDS get upto say 10, then sure it would have lasted much much longer. Now whether my RODI water would then need anything doing to it (remineralisation etc) I do not know - so control and consistency definitely a plus for the countertop unit

 

The waste was clearly ‘a waste’ but where possible I would use it in the garden etc.

 

.....I am a sucker for a toy tho’ so who knows!


Gaggia Classic : Vario : Espresso Gear Tamper

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I've been using the osmio for 2 weeks now and I'm really happy with It, although It took about a week to get rid of the 'new' taste.

I now struggle to drink water round my parents, and when I've finished my bottle of osmio water at work and fill up with their water It's not very nice.

 

I haven't used the water for coffee yet as I still have a few packs of Volvic to get through. But my Tea taste better from the unit.

 

Yes It's expensive but happy that I bought one, I'm drinking a lot more water than I used to which must be a good thing.


Londinium I / Monolith Conical / Macap MC4 / Cormorant CR600 Roaster

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I've been using the osmio for 2 weeks now and I'm really happy with It, although It took about a week to get rid of the 'new' taste.

I now struggle to drink water round my parents, and when I've finished my bottle of osmio water at work and fill up with their water It's not very nice.

 

I haven't used the water for coffee yet as I still have a few packs of Volvic to get through. But my Tea taste better from the unit.

 

Yes It's expensive but happy that I bought one, I'm drinking a lot more water than I used to which must be a good thing.

 

It's potentially a drawback to going RO, you realise just how bad tap water tastes. Sure it's not cheap, but I love it for what it does, lack of water wasts and no need for a kettle. It's quietly taken it's place in our kitchen and I removed the hot water boiler 2 weeks ago....no one said a word! ;).

 

I am planning a short article on the wordpress site, just for coffee people, summarising some of what's already been said on here and a video for sterilisation. I'm not 100% happy with the production values, but really can't be arsed to film it all again.


 My reviews at http://coffeestuff.byethost12.com/ (now ad free)  Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ (old site)

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I've removed the kettle and Brita filter jug and It sits in the corner doing It's thing. :)


Londinium I / Monolith Conical / Macap MC4 / Cormorant CR600 Roaster

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I can imagine liking it for drinking and tea/coffee, but I couldn't live without a kettle for cooking, getting pan fulls of water boiling etc

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Hi!

Maybe a strange question but is it hackable? asking as the ro membrane 50GPD could cost below 10GBP, the same story with a bag of brewing activated carbon. Did anyone try to open the filter "boxes" and check if there is any simple way to replace them with generic ones or refill?

What is inside the first filter installed at the bottom of the 5l tank? what about square remineralization filter, what is the lifespan of it?

I am new here and not so sure if this is the right place for me, I am a bit technical person and I'd love to take a little bit more out of everything around me when possible, thanks

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Hi!

Maybe a strange question but is it hackable? asking as the ro membrane 50GPD could cost below 10GBP, the same story with a bag of brewing activated carbon. Did anyone try to open the filter "boxes" and check if there is any simple way to replace them with generic ones or refill?

What is inside the first filter installed at the bottom of the 5l tank? what about square remineralization filter, what is the lifespan of it?

I am new here and not so sure if this is the right place for me, I am a bit technical person and I'd love to take a little bit more out of everything around me when possible, thanks

 

You should buy one and have a go at hacking it....let us all know what you are able to achieve.


 My reviews at http://coffeestuff.byethost12.com/ (now ad free)  Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ (old site)

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You should buy one and have a go at hacking it....let us all know what you are able to achieve.

Got it delivered yesterday, probably will wait to the time when I need to replace the filters so I can play with the old ones, I have asked here with the hope that someone checked it already :)

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Thank you for the review - and the transparency.

 

I have been thinking of converting the whole house to RO. Not quite sure of the expense of this though.

 

I have noticed that I clean the shower heads and just a week later half the ports don't "fire" water because they are clogged with black or white gunk. Not to mention kettles or coffee machines getting clogged with white gunk extremely quickly, though I use bottled water for the Gaggia but it doesn't seem to make any difference - I clean it with tap water, maybe that does it?

 

Either way gunk isn't fun.


 

 

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Thank you @DavecUK for the review and for everyone's useful comments in this thread.

 

I am very interested in this device for my new Lelit machine and to save wastage from plastic bottled water. According to Anglia Water my water is 240ppm/'hard' and I would look to use this for all Lelit coffees, general tea making and everyday water. I would expect around 5 litres of water every day for myself and my partner (and kids when they are not drinking coke!).

 

Can anyone advise yet (doubtful as many haven't had it for very long!) how often I would need to replace the filters? Obviously I am above the recommend 200ppm and 6 month cycle.

 

Many thanks


Lelit Mara 62 Delux | Niche Zero

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Maybe 12 month


SAGE IS NOT A UPGRADE

 

 

:)

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Thank you for the review - and the transparency.

 

I have been thinking of converting the whole house to RO. Not quite sure of the expense of this though.

 

I have noticed that I clean the shower heads and just a week later half the ports don't "fire" water because they are clogged with black or white gunk. Not to mention kettles or coffee machines getting clogged with white gunk extremely quickly, though I use bottled water for the Gaggia but it doesn't seem to make any difference - I clean it with tap water, maybe that does it?

 

Either way gunk isn't fun.

I put 3 things into my house for all round water improvement:

1. water softener on all except outside tap

2. RO (undercounter for 3 years and now replaced by Osmio)

3. Magnaclean into radiator/boiler circuit to pick up the iron deposits

 

Aimed at the balance of efficiency in house heating/coffee-machine reliability, expense and minimising waste water, cleaning products etc.


ACS Vesuvius, Niche Zero, Dalian Amazon & assorted greens, Osmio Zero

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Thank you @DavecUK for the review and for everyone's useful comments in this thread.

 

I am very interested in this device for my new Lelit machine and to save wastage from plastic bottled water. According to Anglia Water my water is 240ppm/'hard' and I would look to use this for all Lelit coffees, general tea making and everyday water. I would expect around 5 litres of water every day for myself and my partner (and kids when they are not drinking coke!).

 

Can anyone advise yet (doubtful as many haven't had it for very long!) how often I would need to replace the filters? Obviously I am above the recommend 200ppm and 6 month cycle.

 

Many thanks

 

I would have thought you would get close to the 6 months, although I think your water may be harder than that at times...you can always check with a meter in the summer. However, even if it's sooner you can always buy the membrane double packs and change the membrane separately when it needs it saving the other filters for something more around the 6 -8 months mark. It all depends...5 litres per day isn't very much. my water is 280 ppm and softened and I use around 20 litres per day. 7 weeks in and it's still fine. So based on that, I have used about 1000 litres. Doing the math, it looks like you should get to the 6 month mark.


 My reviews at http://coffeestuff.byethost12.com/ (now ad free)  Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ (old site)

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I would have thought you would get close to the 6 months, although I think your water may be harder than that at times...you can always check with a meter in the summer. However, even if it's sooner you can always buy the membrane double packs and change the membrane separately when it needs it saving the other filters for something more around the 6 -8 months mark. It all depends...5 litres per day isn't very much. my water is 280 ppm and softened and I use around 20 litres per day. 7 weeks in and it's still fine. So based on that, I have used about 1000 litres. Doing the math, it looks like you should get to the 6 month mark.

 

Ok thanks for the advice. According to the Anglia Water site the region next to mine is 350-390(!!) so I guess mine could waver. 5 litres is a total guess at present.


Lelit Mara 62 Delux | Niche Zero

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Ok thanks for the advice. According to the Anglia Water site the region next to mine is 350-390(!!) so I guess mine could waver. 5 litres is a total guess at present.

 

Yeah, that sounds more like it...East Anglia is to espresso machines like sending Cassandra O Brien into the Gobi desert without moisturiser.....neither will last long. If you have to change the filters ever 3 or 4 months, so be it, or have to change the membrane every 3 months and the other filters every 6 months. If you are in that area, you are probably on a water meter, so conventional RO would work out quite expensive as well with the reject rate..


 My reviews at http://coffeestuff.byethost12.com/ (now ad free)  Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ (old site)

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Yeah, that sounds more like it...East Anglia is to espresso machines like sending Cassandra O Brien into the Gobi desert without moisturiser.....neither will last long. If you have to change the filters ever 3 or 4 months, so be it, or have to change the membrane every 3 months and the other filters every 6 months. If you are in that area, you are probably on a water meter, so conventional RO would work out quite expensive as well with the reject rate..

 

Thanks. How would you know when to change them independently? Guess work? An entry on a calendar? Taste?


Lelit Mara 62 Delux | Niche Zero

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Thanks. How would you know when to change them independently? Guess work? An entry on a calendar? Taste?

 

The Osmio Zero tells you via an indicator light for the membrane, for the others 6 monthly.


 My reviews at http://coffeestuff.byethost12.com/ (now ad free)  Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ (old site)

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Now there are some of these "in the wild", has anybody measured the GH:KH or tried to titrate the water post re-mineralisation to see what's going on? (I'm aware this will vary based on supplied water and usage rate - just interested to see)

 

Those who previously used bottled water for coffee how do you feel the taste of coffee with the Osmio compares?

Edited by Power Freak

Spro === Compak E8 Redspeed / OE Pharos ---> The Rising Force Tamper ---> LR (IMS 35um + VST 18g) / Cafelat Robot Filter === OE Apex / OE Lido 3 ---> v60 (chemex papers) / Able brewing system / Aeropress Water === Osmio Zero

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