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La Pavoni Europiccola advice?

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I have a pre millennium model so the 49mm basket. I was putting in 13g of coffee but I've been advised to try less. Any of you have an opinion on this? Also how long and how hard are you pulling on the lever? My last attempts I was hanging on it for 2min with 12g in the basket which seems a bit extreme. I'm now going to change my beans, I just picked up a bag from Curve Roasters as the last coffee I had was a mess (to be fair they told me at the time it was a hard bean to use). How much will grind size vary from bean to bean? Any tips would be greatly appreciated.

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only a week or so of using a pre millenium la pav and im getting good results with the following -

 

Beans Rave fudge

Grinder Super Jolly

weight in basket 13.5g

false pressure bled for 5-10 seconds with lever 3/4 way up

pull 30 seconds

wet weight in cup 25g

 

Its taken a lot of adjustments to grind to get to this point - I was grinding finer but was having to use two hands to pull the lever!! I adjusted the grind at this point until the lever was reasonable.

 

My thoughts are that the pull on the lever at the moment is less than the 30lb recommended so I will edge the grinder finer - the le pav seems a lot more sensitive to grind than my old classic,

 

Hope this helps - Jim


all opinions are my own I have not received any free equipment or favours from suppliers 

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Sounds like you've almost nailed it. I need to grind coarser as hanging on the machine and 2min can't be right. Before when I went coarser my output was 32g with no crema and gritty but I don't think the beans helped.

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What are you grinding with? - ive not managed to get 32g out of it - just wondering if you need to change the seals?


all opinions are my own I have not received any free equipment or favours from suppliers 

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It's just been serviced and I'm grinding with a La Cimbali Magnum

 

Blimey that should do it,

 

Tamp lighter? With a 49mm tamper, flat base


all opinions are my own I have not received any free equipment or favours from suppliers 

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I've got a Motta 49mm tamper and trying not to tamp hard. I've tried 13g and 12g in the basket and the grinder from so fine I can't pull to pulling straight through and getting murky water. I probably need to order a large batch of beans but I've been in London so just tried picking some up locally. I'm off to France for the next few months tomorrow or Friday so probably need to find a roaster out there or order from someone like Rave that will ship. I bought a bag of beans from Curve Roasters yesterday but I only have 250g, haven't tried them yet.

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For me - I'm not sure re the temp, but I've got some heatsinks on the way from Hong Kong to see if it helps.


all opinions are my own I have not received any free equipment or favours from suppliers 

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That's one thing I don't have is a thermometer to test the water. I've been letting the machine warm up for 30 min before using

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5-10 minutes once boiled, quick flush and am good to go on the G105 which is 51mm so post millennium, if that helps.

If left on longer than that then tend to find a large amount of steam comes out when first flush and would assume pre millennium's the same ( recall from the forum day at Rave Oct 16, all the europiccola types there which were left on were wrapped in wet teatowels)

 

John


Roasters: BB Dalian Amazon 1kg -Power contolled GeneCafe 101- 92Kg of greens - Tonino

Espresso: Londinium L2 - Gaggia G105 - Silvia v3 Mr.Shades PID'-d - Faema E92a2 (Project) - MyPressi Twist - VST baskets / Motta Europa (350/500/750ml) - Torr Ti 58.55 & Goldfinger flat 58.4 TiBlack, Pullman 51.4 - Acaia x2

Grinders: Flats: Compak R120 - NS Mythos plus Conics: Compak K10PB - Lido 3

Brewed: Behmor Brazen - Moccamaster KBGT471 - Aeropress - V60 - Cona model D - Clever - Mizudashi - 8-10 + 6 cup Chemex

Water: BWT Bestmax V Refrac: VST III

and a Puq Press not in a pear tree..

 

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I've seen on YouTube that you can get the group head to temp by heating it up and then flushing it through 3 or 4 times. The only problem with that is that it doesn't leave you much water to run a few cups. This won't be a problem once I figure it out and I'm just making myself one cup at a time.

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Whilst I can only go on taste in the cup as a measure of hot enough, no access to a scace, only do 1 small flush which I use to heat the cups then grind the beans, gives perfectly satisfactory results with enough water left for steaming milk and at least 2 more espresso.

They don't need to be huge flushes, when you think of how much water you pull through the group to create your espresso it doesn't need to be any more than this even if duplicated 3 or 4 times.

Worst case if you run low on water, release the pressure through the steam wand refill with water and all boiled again within 5 minutes max but now with a warm group :) During the day when don't want to have the L2 consuming the national grid, this is one of the endearing benefits of this type of machine: quick to heat up and quick to re heat if needed (results in the cup are different to the L2 but perfectly drinkable and punching way above the cost of the machine in comparison)

Worth a try if nothing else as will at least rule out the temp variable

Stick with it and hope the new beans provide a better result (just remember to account for purging previous grinds when adjusting grind setting otherwise gives a false indication)

John


Roasters: BB Dalian Amazon 1kg -Power contolled GeneCafe 101- 92Kg of greens - Tonino

Espresso: Londinium L2 - Gaggia G105 - Silvia v3 Mr.Shades PID'-d - Faema E92a2 (Project) - MyPressi Twist - VST baskets / Motta Europa (350/500/750ml) - Torr Ti 58.55 & Goldfinger flat 58.4 TiBlack, Pullman 51.4 - Acaia x2

Grinders: Flats: Compak R120 - NS Mythos plus Conics: Compak K10PB - Lido 3

Brewed: Behmor Brazen - Moccamaster KBGT471 - Aeropress - V60 - Cona model D - Clever - Mizudashi - 8-10 + 6 cup Chemex

Water: BWT Bestmax V Refrac: VST III

and a Puq Press not in a pear tree..

 

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My routine consists of..

 

  • Fill boiler with Volvic.
  • Switch on (I keep large jug hooked under the steam wand, small jug under the spout).
  • When up to temp, open steam wand until I get a good blast out of it and then shut off.
  • Leave standing for about 20 mins.
  • Pump handle up and down, not enough for water to come out though.
  • Grind either 15g or 16g of beans (51mm basket millennium version).
  • Medium tamp.
  • Loosely fit and pull lever up to just before filling point.
  • Tighten pf and raise lever fully.
  • Wait 10s, pull slightly down with minimal pressure until drips appear.
  • Pull lever and watch for an even pour.
  • Steam milk to 65 deg (Espro Toroid pitcher, Rhinowares thermometer).
  • Purge/wipe steam arm.
  • Pour milk into cup and make pretty splodge on top.
  • Drink..

 

 

I'e gotten into the habit of doing the normal pre-infuse then pulling slightly and holding to increase pre-infuse pressure until drips appear then pulling. Also I try to avoid letting the water enter the group in one short blast, but instead lift the lever until I hear the water start to fill and let it gradually fill. I don't know if letting the group fill in one surge affects the puck or not?


Input: 'Terranovered’ Versalab M3 + Mahlkonig EK43 Turkish burrs + Niche

Output: KVdW Speedster + V60 + AeroPress + Syphon + Bialetti Induction Moka Pot + Bialetti Mucka Express + jar of instant for visitors..

 

 

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Thanks for the tips guys, i'll have another go in the morning. Out of curiosity what beans are you using? I'm thinking of just getting any that are easy to work with and once I get a good espresso experiment with different beans.

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I would stick with Rave, and get there signature blend - at least it will be fairly consistent and well roasted.


all opinions are my own I have not received any free equipment or favours from suppliers 

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Sounds good jimbojohn55, I should have ordered some a few days ago in time to take with me but I think Rave post to France so I'll just do that.

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I'm mainly using Coffee Compass, got some lovely decaf and just got some mahogany roast Ethiopian as well. Seam to be going DSOL at the min.


Input: 'Terranovered’ Versalab M3 + Mahlkonig EK43 Turkish burrs + Niche

Output: KVdW Speedster + V60 + AeroPress + Syphon + Bialetti Induction Moka Pot + Bialetti Mucka Express + jar of instant for visitors..

 

 

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I've finally had a chance to have another go on the Pavoni. I'm getting closer, I've had to go coarser on the grinder. My last attemp and the best so far I had 12.5g in the basket out 30.6g and took 36 seconds to pull. The result was half decent crema but bitter taste. What would you guys suggest next, more coffee in the basket, firmer tamp, slightly coarser or finer grind?

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12.5 into 30.6 is huge for a la pavoni. I would bring the ratio down, they shine on 1 into 1.5 - 2 at most!


AKA Toffee chips

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12.5 into 30.6 is huge for a la pavoni. I would bring the ratio down, they shine on 1 into 1.5 - 2 at most!

Thanks what's the best way of doing that?

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I'm at the same point - I'm experimenting with the number of seconds the lever is held at the top of the stroke - 10 seconds gives me 29-30g, 7 seconds gives me 23 -24g - I think the purge time while held 3/4 up the stroke also has an influence.


all opinions are my own I have not received any free equipment or favours from suppliers 

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I'm at the same point - I'm experimenting with the number of seconds the lever is held at the top of the stroke - 10 seconds gives me 29-30g, 7 seconds gives me 23 -24g - I think the purge time while held 3/4 up the stroke also has an influence.

 

I was thinking of playing about with that today as I've been holding it up about 15 seconds

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At last a good espresso!! Having another attempt tonight I've just about got it. My first attempt I kept the grind the same as yesterday but increased the amount of coffee to 13g in basket. I only held the lever up for 5 seconds, 45 second pull with 22g out and good crema. Taste was a bit bitter. Next attempt I went half a notch coarser on the grind and everything else the same except I accidentally lifted the lever up slightly during the pull. The result was 25g out good crema and no bitterness.

 

Where ive been going wrong. Holding the lever up too long resulting in too large of an output and too fine on the grind. I was pulling so hard on the lever that boiler has come loose.

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That didn't last long!! My output is getting heavier with the same variables. I only held the lever up for 3 seconds and got 30g in the cup. Besides holding the lever all the way up is there anything else that contributes to the amount of water that goes through the portafilter?

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