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charris

La Marzocco Group Buy

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Yeah, its a long shot and probably not worth it, but it is an option.


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@bronc & @AMCD300 livein Europe, just get them to forward on, not sure how much that would cost though!

 

I live in Europe... I don't understand the difference ;-P

 

TBH most things I hear about make me NOT want to live in Europe....

 

Maybe I'd best move to Ireland....


Ghe sboro fioi!

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That's an option but if something happens during shipping it can be a pain in the ass.

 

Perhaps that's the opinion of the retailer too


I write a blog, it's nothing to do with coffee ...

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Hmm last time I checked both UK and Ireland were in Europe.

 

T.


Espresso: Londinium L1, ZR-71 grinder

Photography: Flickr

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if you buy one though, the LA MArzocco UK will not honour the warranty

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Perhaps that's the opinion of the retailer too

I was talking about the forwarding.

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if you buy one though, the LA MArzocco UK will not honour the warranty

Aren't they forced to according to EU law?

 

T.


Espresso: Londinium L1, ZR-71 grinder

Photography: Flickr

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Aren't they forced to according to EU law?

 

T.

 

No, they are a separate company, created to oversee LM in the UK, except there are several other firms around who have health with LM for longer...all seems a bit stupid but it is the usual control freak situation.....if the manufacturer gave the warranty this would be no issue

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Aren't they forced to according to EU law?

 

T.

 

No. This is a huge misconception. The local distributor has no 'legal' obligation to help at all. Nor the manufacturer. Only the outlet you bought it from. They are the source liable for all problems under warranty.

 

So never accept ' the manufacturer won't cover that'.... it's the retailer's obligation.

 

That isn't to say that a credible manufacturer/distributor will not support it's retailers, but by default they do not have to.

 

Hence in another thread, (removed i think due to links to an online retailer) i said that there is no point having a UK distributor over an EU distributor offering different services. I think this under EU law IS illegal. As this model is otherwise 'outing' members from one of the 'combined nations'.


Ghe sboro fioi!

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if you buy one though, the LA MArzocco UK will not honour the warranty

 

This is probably true. But La Marzocco Eu/De should if they ARE the company they are RECOMMENDED for being.

 

Personally I think if LM UK don't then this is appalling as a 'member' of the larger / supportive company.

 

It comes down to company ethos at the end of the day. With respect to warranty I wish more companies would follow Apples ethos - i.e., you brake it we can replace it for reduced cost. If it brakes under warranty, we will repair it IRRESPECTIVE of where you bought it. While apple have their flaws, this aspect is incredible and functions internationally.

 

It's this kind of regional BS proposed here ie., UK vs Eu warranty that actually would put me off / has already put me off buying an LM product. Same for many manufacturers.


Ghe sboro fioi!

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Read the last few pages with interest. As regards the drop shipping, it's quite easy for the manufacturers to set up a wholesale network that dropships and does not sell to the general public, but just takes orders from authorised dealers and has an agreed drop ship zone. This keeps the sales "in country" if required and it's not illegal. The authorised dealer then supports the warranty. There are slight variations of this arrangement. it's not in LM interest to let groups from coffee forums get together and buy outside the dealer network, or flout the agreements they have in place.

 

Where dealers buy the product, then they usually buy out the warranty and the support from the factory is often on a parts only basis....these parts are usually sent out with a future order, or done as credit on a future order. This means often with a new line the dealer has to invest in any basic bespoke parts.

 

If you want cheap LM machines, I think your best bet would be to find a UK retailer (who can order LM products), agree how many you want, agree warranty terms, which would be different to normal. Pay upfront and wait for the products. you would have to pay shipping costs for the Pallet (1 more than a pallet, costs a lot more, half a pallet costs about the same), shipping less risks damage. Decide on the risk your willing to take for damaged product. Agree a margin with the retailer. This will net you a final price that may be a little better. There has to be something in it for the retailer and I'm not sure whether you can buy with no warranty at all.


ACS Vesuvius DBPP, Izzo Duetto DB, Minima DB, Lelit Bianca Prototype DB (paddle flow control) BTC Machines: Roasters: Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster, other failed roasters: Grinders: Ceado E92, Niche US and UK: 145kg assorted greens: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/

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@DavecUK thanks for the info. This 'dropship' method reads like a total PITA.

 

For the potential saving - i think it was quoted here at around £1000 on a GS3 - i would still be very tempted to travel to Germany, or otherwise have a foreign based 'friend' accept the delivery. I would then happily visit my 'friend' should i ever need parts 'under warranty'.

 

This drop ship method seems to help 'legally' support price fixes in different countries across the EU (unless i'm reading into this incorrectly). It also doesn't read as if it's particularly helpful for 'authorised retailers' when supporting warranty claims.


Ghe sboro fioi!

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This drop ship method seems to help 'legally' support price fixes in different countries across the EU (unless i'm reading into this incorrectly). It also doesn't read as if it's particularly helpful for 'authorised retailers' when supporting warranty claims.

 

If it's real effect is just to exclude people based on their location it might not actually be legal.

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@DavecUK thanks for the info. This 'dropship' method reads like a total PITA.

 

For the potential saving - i think it was quoted here at around £1000 on a GS3 - i would still be very tempted to travel to Germany, or otherwise have a foreign based 'friend' accept the delivery. I would then happily visit my 'friend' should i ever need parts 'under warranty'.

 

This drop ship method seems to help 'legally' support price fixes in different countries across the EU (unless i'm reading into this incorrectly). It also doesn't read as if it's particularly helpful for 'authorised retailers' when supporting warranty claims.

 

I think what people need to look at is how you support the retailers, what are the warranty issues, is every penny saved important at the expense of service, parts and goodwill. I remember the bad old days when it was hard to buy a prosumer machine, the ones that were around were expensive, parts were a sod to get hold of and again very expensive. The variety and range of machines was hugely limited. Now you enjoy many retailers, a good selection, easy accessibility to parts and far better as well as more advanced machines....how do you think all that happened?

 

However, if every penny is important and you want to buy cheapest, support the box shifters.....you might find what you get for the entire coffee community that follows, is a fairly poor deal. you might save a few pounds, but eventually you affect the market. Machines might even become cheaper, not because you were being ripped off, but because they make them cheaper, with cheaper stuff.....at that point it's a short step to paying for a lot less than the value you get from many machines today. I'd like to think I played a significant part in the situation you all enjoy today with respect to the quality and function of espresso machines on the market now...although it's easily undone by box shifting and price cutting.

 

You can have it cheap or you can have it good....this goes for machines, service, parts etc.. Think of all the absolute chinese crap (not talking coffee machines, just general goods) are on the market, then shifted by pile it high and sell it cheap retailers who don't care what they sell. e.g. Hoverboards etc..

 

 

I really wish you guys could see the review I did on the El Rocio...because that's the route things might begin to move down.


ACS Vesuvius DBPP, Izzo Duetto DB, Minima DB, Lelit Bianca Prototype DB (paddle flow control) BTC Machines: Roasters: Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster, other failed roasters: Grinders: Ceado E92, Niche US and UK: 145kg assorted greens: My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/

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If it's real effect is just to exclude people based on their location it might not actually be legal.

 

http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/shopping/buying-services/index_en.htm

 

Based on this you cannot be refused purchase only because you live outside the country you want to purchase a product in, unless of course there's an objective reason. I'm sure you can always come up with an objective reason to not sell if you don't really want to and no-one can stop you. Is "can't be bothered" a good enough objective reason? Who's going to prove that a seller refuses to sell ONLY because you live in another country? Silly law, silly EU imho.

 

T.


Espresso: Londinium L1, ZR-71 grinder

Photography: Flickr

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Can anyone tell me how many retailers in the UK have GS3's in stock? Doing a basic online search, going to the popular and recommended retailers most of us have used, I can't see any that have a GS3 in stock.

 

Anyone got any light on this?


Ghe sboro fioi!

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Coffee Omega had one in stock when i made some enquiries last year, think BB did too

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But now? BB don't (according to their site).

 

Basically, the point that I was going to make was around box shifting. i.e., some have cast their views on box shifters, yet (tongue in cheek) the retailers I have just looked around (limited to online searches) would be doing just that.... yet want far higher prices than the EU based store(s)....

 

Happy to be proven wrong here.


Ghe sboro fioi!

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@bongo Take it to the European Parliament or negotiate with the U.K or European retailers ... Nothing on this thread is gonna change the price


I write a blog, it's nothing to do with coffee ...

https://rjwinc.wordpress.com

Instagram - rjw_inc

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I agree that this isn't going to change price. I'm trying to get my head around what seems to be a monumental flaw in these models, bordering on legal - non legal exercises, and perhaps, perhaps some potential closed mindedness / blindness on the part of some proud to buy British advocates....

 

Either way, I'm not going to actually buy one. I can't afford to, even with a £1k saving.


Ghe sboro fioi!

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@bongo Take it to the European Parliament or negotiate with the U.K or European retailers ... Nothing on this thread is gonna change the price

 

To Strasbourg!

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I agree that this isn't going to change price. I'm trying to get my head around what seems to be a monumental flaw in these models, bordering on legal - non legal exercises, and perhaps, perhaps some potential closed mindedness / blindness on the part of some proud to buy British advocates....

 

Either way, I'm not going to actually buy one. I can't afford to, even with a £1k saving.

I wouldn't look for flaws, the reason is fairly simple and common - profit. Every distributor wants as much of it as possible with as little hassle as possible. Shipping a big, heavy machine abroad is hassle and a risk, profit when selling to a single individual is minimal. They want to earn money as much as you want to save money.

 

T.


Espresso: Londinium L1, ZR-71 grinder

Photography: Flickr

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It's got to get on a plane and cross the channel at some point though -

a) La Marzocco make it in Italy, ship it to Germany and someone then ships it to the UK

b) LM make it in Italy, then ship direct to the UK.

 

The extra set of hands involved might increase the risk, but the shipping thing is a bit of a red herring.

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Are we now talking dealers getting batches of machines factory packed or single machines being sent by a non-UK dealer to a buyer in the UK? The risk and costs involved are different imho.

 

T.


Espresso: Londinium L1, ZR-71 grinder

Photography: Flickr

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