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Aillio bullet R1 roaster pre- orders

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Video showing an almost finalised version of the Alio roasting at a show.

 


Slayer One Group ; Versalab M3/4

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What bothers me about the Alio is that I cant see any way of venting the smoke to the outside. It was bad enough with a Hottop roasting only 250 grams, I hate to think what 1kg would be like.

 

I asked them about this, they said that you can connect a part to the vent to vent out the smoke. They are not making them to order yet and they will 3d print them on request. The more people that ask then the more they will be interested in producing this part, as I agree what the hell happens to 1KG of beans smoke! (BTW I need a 80mm pipe vent)

 

Here's the reply

 

"

The adapter will have to be ordered separately as we do not want to keep them in stock- for a bunch of reasons, but mainly because its not a popular item, and because of the many different sizes.

I will find out before shipping if anyone else is interested, and I will make some.

 

 

Lately what we have done is to turn the exhaust fan to full power just before dumping the beans, and then cooling them as fast as possible. This releases the least amount of smoke, and has not been a problem for us.

You could connect an additional exhaust pipe for the cooling tray if the above does not work. Also really depends on how dark you roast them. and batch size of course."

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"

 

1. The adapter will have to be ordered separately as we do not want to keep them in stock- for a bunch of reasons, but mainly because its not a popular item, and because of the many different sizes.

I will find out before shipping if anyone else is interested, and I will make some.

 

 

2 Lately what we have done is to turn the exhaust fan to full power just before dumping the beans, and then cooling them as fast as possible. This releases the least amount of smoke, and has not been a problem for us.

You could connect an additional exhaust pipe for the cooling tray if the above does not work. Also really depends on how dark you roast them. and batch size of course."

 

1. Is a FU reply, complete excuse, they only have to have 1 size, not multiple sizes of exit pipe diameter, so total rubbish?????

 

2. Err having significant experience of 1kg and larger roasters, most of the smoke is released in the last part of roasting and what is released before that probably isn't good to breathe in. I liken their reply to urinating on a plant that has caught fire near a burning house and saying it significantly reduces the damage to the property as a whole.

 

It does look a good roaster on paper and the 500g roasts in the videos look OK, but that doesn't account for how they taste, how it does 1kg loads and how they taste. Also how the roaster fares over a much longer period of use and especially with darker roasts. I understand (from comments on this forum) they recommend roasting only 3kg in a day...I don't even understand if this is back to back roasting or just 3kg per day. Indeed will back to back roasting be a problem, how does it respond and what happens over a long period of time.

 

I think the induction heating is potentially a great idea, even though it changes the thermal dynamic somewhat from more conventional designs...this could be a great roaster, or it might be more like another American roaster I won't mention, where the promise was perhaps more than it delivered..

 

From my own personal experience of my current roaster on test, the designers/manufacturers of roasters don't always make the best decisions and often they are happy if something works just OK, rather than excellent. I have found myself having to make significant demands on a redesign of certain elements, even so far as having to tell them exactly what and how to do it!

 

So yes I understand the pre-order price (1584 euro) is a great saving and supposedly you will save 416 euro on the final price of 2400 euro...that's £300 BUT, if there are problems, or need for major design changes, then that £300 saving won't seem like very much. it also strikes me they want to grab all the sales they can directly from their website with the pre-orders and then go to retailers later so that as future trickle orders happen they have an in country presence of spares and support. I am not sure the retailers are going to love that situation, especially as Allilio can do a direct sales deal and undercut the retailers any time they like.


 My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ - Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: YouTube channel at https://tinyurl.com/szhgxzl .......

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1. Is a FU reply, complete excuse, they only have to have 1 size, not multiple sizes of exit pipe diameter, so total rubbish?????

 

2. Err having significant experience of 1kg and larger roasters, most of the smoke is released in the last part of roasting and what is released before that probably isn't good to breathe in. I liken their reply to urinating on a plant that has caught fire near a burning house and saying it significantly reduces the damage to the property as a whole.

 

It does look a good roaster on paper and the 500g roasts in the videos look OK, but that doesn't account for how they taste, how it does 1kg loads and how they taste. Also how the roaster fares over a much longer period of use and especially with darker roasts. I understand (from comments on this forum) they recommend roasting only 3kg in a day...I don't even understand if this is back to back roasting or just 3kg per day. Indeed will back to back roasting be a problem, how does it respond and what happens over a long period of time.

 

I think the induction heating is potentially a great idea, even though it changes the thermal dynamic somewhat from more conventional designs...this could be a great roaster, or it might be more like another American roaster I won't mention, where the promise was perhaps more than it delivered..

 

From my own personal experience of my current roaster on test, the designers/manufacturers of roasters don't always make the best decisions and often they are happy if something works just OK, rather than excellent. I have found myself having to make significant demands on a redesign of certain elements, even so far as having to tell them exactly what and how to do it!

 

So yes I understand the pre-order price (1584 euro) is a great saving and supposedly you will save 416 euro on the final price of 2400 euro...that's £300 BUT, if there are problems, or need for major design changes, then that £300 saving won't seem like very much. it also strikes me they want to grab all the sales they can directly from their website with the pre-orders and then go to retailers later so that as future trickle orders happen they have an in country presence of spares and support. I am not sure the retailers are going to love that situation, especially as Allilio can do a direct sales deal and undercut the retailers any time they like.

 

Well duno if you've ever produced a product from scratch (I have) if extremely difficult and a huge risk and so very very easy to criticize before it's even lauched. Yes, it probably does need a few iterations to get it right. However, as a 'Pre-order,er," ;) I think this machine has so much potential I felt it was worth the risk. No, it probably won't get it right first time around, but who knows it may just be a great start & better then other machines on the market?!

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Well duno if you've ever produced a product from scratch (I have) if extremely difficult and a huge risk and so very very easy to criticize before it's even lauched. Yes, it probably does need a few iterations to get it right. However, as a 'Pre-order,er," ;) I think this machine has so much potential I felt it was worth the risk. No, it probably won't get it right first time around, but who knows it may just be a great start & better then other machines on the market?!

 

I understand what you're saying but:

 

 

  • How do they know the part required to vent smoke is not a "popular item"?
  • Why do they think it needs to be manufactured in different sizes, no one else ever does that with vent attachments and a range of duct reducers/enlargers are fully available
  • They really expect you to believe some magic with the fan in the cooling tray is going to significantly reduce smoke!

 

Sure I have only helped develop products from scratch, not made them myself, but really when designing a roaster, the venting is such a basic requirement. It just seemed like they were taking the piss a bit with their reply. I agree the roaster could be great and I hope yours is, I am especially looking forward to reading reviews of the roaster. I just hope their attitude to venting has not permeated to other aspects of the roaster (e.g. no Tryer)


 My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ - Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: YouTube channel at https://tinyurl.com/szhgxzl .......

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I understand what you're saying but:

 

 

  • How do they know the part required to vent smoke is not a "popular item"? -( They probably don't, as I doubt they have conducted any research, they have probably just designed it how they see it. Still, as long as you could add one later, when/if people demand it, shouldn't be a biggy (as long as it works!)-
  • Why do they think it needs to be manufactured in different sizes, no one else ever does that with vent attachments and a range of duct reducers/enlargers are fully available -(Probably was the first thing that came into his head, as yes sure they just need one size and people can adapt. I'll suggest this to them.)-
  • They really expect you to believe some magic with the fan in the cooling tray is going to significantly reduce smoke! -(Here I agree with you. If this is a problem I'm going to fit an oven extraction fan so it can be a full steam when the beans come out of the roaster!)-

 

Sure I have only helped develop products from scratch, not made them myself, but really when designing a roaster, the venting is such a basic requirement. It just seemed like they were taking the piss a bit with their reply. I agree the roaster could be great and I hope yours is, I am especially looking forward to reading reviews of the roaster. I just hope their attitude to venting has not permeated to other aspects of the roaster (e.g. no Tryer)

 

- Again agree with you, but it's always hard to cover everything in your first iteration. This is why companies spend so much on research, to make sure they've covered all the bases. I'm sure these guys haven't got any kind of budget. Fingers crossed & I'm actually more worried about it actually being produced this year!

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- Again agree with you, but it's always hard to cover everything in your first iteration. This is why companies spend so much on research, to make sure they've covered all the bases. I'm sure these guys haven't got any kind of budget. Fingers crossed & I'm actually more worried about it actually being produced this year!

 

 

I think it will almost certainly get produced this year...well they said last Qtr which could be Dec 2015 thru Mar 2016. They seem to have come a long way to not produce the product.


 My reviews at https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/ - Various Machines and grinders, Amazon Dalian 1kg Drum Roaster: YouTube channel at https://tinyurl.com/szhgxzl .......

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i see there's only 15 roasters by December, looks like a long wait out side pre order, there still messing with electronic features, now have auto-start for ambient temp when beans added, 3 new exhaust adapters,

and there's more, now no bluetooth, working with cropster to integrate software. glad they sorted the induction coil out which was upwards of 450v, that sounds warm.

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Update on smoke adapters, doesn't sound promising :(

 

coffeejon

Please let us know, as I understand, the temp of hot air coming from the Bullet will be 180-240c and that will melt a 3d printed part for the exhaust part, as 60c max i've been told. How do you suggest creating this part & why can you not supply the part?

 

 

993060_171673546351242_1432857679_n.png?oh=accaf4d64c60cc4eaa6c1d37c25b473b&oe=56EDE65A

 

Aillio Thanks for the feedback. If we decided to go down this path, you will be the first to know. Unfortunately a plastic tooling for this parts are around 8,000US$ so I need to know there will be a high enough demand.

I can report that the 3D printed ABS part I am using has held up without any problems.

 

 

coffeejon Ok thx for reply. I'll look into ABS. Maybe you could send out a mail to all who have pre-ordered and ask them? I again would have no problem pre-ordering if you need the upfront tooling costs.

 

 

coffeejon Ok, been told ABS should take 100c at a part cost of £100-£150!!!! They told me I need 'Altem' which can take 200c at a part cost of £200-£250! This is rather expensive for a small part. Please re-consider producing this part, as this is very expensive for your customers to pay for a part which really should be part of the machine. Thank you

 

 

Aillio One thing is what the Datasheet says, another thing is real world testing. Deflection temp of common ABS is around 100degree C. But only one side is exposed to the high temperature, thus nothing is going to melt.

Shapeways.com can 3D print one in porcelain for around 50 bucks if you worry about the thing melting. I am sure there are a few guys here who has a 3D printer that can print ABS who would probably be willing to help out. Material costs would be less than 3 bucks.

Edited by Coffeejon

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My 3d printer prints ABS, it's softening point is 112deg C and its melting point is 250deg C.

 

I can print you a part if you would like me to, may be worth testing the temperature at the point of contact.

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No problem, It's a small part so shouldn't cost much to print, I'll let you know the cost when I can load it into my printers software. Do feel free to bug my by PM if I forget, as it is more than likely I will!

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umm says " Bluetooth wont be used to start with. Only computers can be connected. They want to make that work before moving on to making an app."

 

phew, means it won't be working initially, but will work at a later date. i really need the BT, so that's good news!

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umm says " Bluetooth wont be used to start with. Only computers can be connected. They want to make that work before moving on to making an app."

 

phew, means it won't be working initially, but will work at a later date. i really need the BT, so that's good news!

 

This

 

I was the one who talked to Jonas, and he said the Bullet already has a "bluetooth unit" (don't know the technical term) but they take one step at a time starting with the PC software.

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No problem, It's a small part so shouldn't cost much to print, I'll let you know the cost when I can load it into my printers software. Do feel free to bug my by PM if I forget, as it is more than likely I will!

 

Thanks Dylan, money sent across for the 80mm Bullet smoke exhaust part. Look fwd to seeing it, will let you know when it arrives. Thx again for help

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No problem. Let me know how it fits as ABS can shrink a bit, but hopefully the tolerances aren't that tight.

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I placed my pre-order yesterday.;) Unfortunately, the price of the Bullet was slightly increased. :(

 

How much if you don't mind me asking?


Twitter @Froggystyle

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How much if you don't mind me asking?

 

It was 1320 €. Now it is 1400 € plus shipping. However the shipping is not clear yet. I was told that it could be between 200-300 €.

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