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MrShades

Gaggia / Silvia - Pt100 RTD sensor for PID

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I've developed these sensors to augment PIDs that are using K thermocouples. Using the Pt100 gives you greater accuracy and access to 0.1c resolution on most PIDs (certainly on the Rex C100).

 

They are 3 wire devices for improved accuracy and are set inside brass M4 bolts with thermal paste and thermal adhesive.

 

The Auber ones have very delicate wires and delicate / fragile connections - using more robust high temp wire and shrink wrap will hopefully make these easier to work with and less fragile.

 

They're not easy for me to make - and just wanted to do it to see if I could, but am willing to make a few to help fellow owners out.

 

Sold with a small brass M4 washer, bagged and including UK postage for £17 (with payment via PayPal Friends and Family or bank transfer, or any other method that means I don't get hit with charges).

 

(If you're a member on here, and would like International Shipping, then I'm willing to do so at cost - and at your risk - so if it goes missing somewhere in Eastern Europe or Japan or the US, and you've not elected for an insured delivery option then it's your loss, not mine. Contact me via PM if you'd like International Shipping quotes - and let me know whether you want cheap/cheerful or fully insured / tracked / traced, etc.).

 

 

 

[uPDATE 17th Dec 2014]

 

I've now gone into "production" on a V2 of these sensors, and not that the build quality on the earlier ones was bad at all - but these are better. I've got 'a few' of them - so stock currently isn't a problem, and I don't see it being a problem in the foreseeable future... so if you want one then please just PM me and I'll send you payment details, etc.

 

These new units are now 750mm leads (which I may well change to 500mm for the next batch - as I think 750mm is still a bit too long... but the Auber ones are only about 450mm which fits/reaches but is slightly too short for my liking.

 

For the record, these sensors are:

 

- Pt100

- Class A

- Mounted in an M4 screw thread, ready for simple fitting into the existing thermowell of the Gaggia boiler

- Three wire (two red, one white)

- 750mm lead wires, bare ends

- 7/0.2mm dia silver plated copper wires

- Thin PTFE sheathed in orange

- OD : 2.13mm +/- 0.15mm

- Pretty damn robust... and you certainly don't feel petrified when handling them or screwing them into the boiler.... like you do with some others!

 

 

Anyway, here's some updated pics of the new ones.... Anyone that has ordered one in the last 5 days will be getting these in the post ASAP

 

 

 

45413e7aceb65d7315d79359d4a441f5.jpg

 

51218523290a914515d2d893189b82bd.jpg

 

6c146729d5e71dfd160489087c01f7fc.jpg

 

 

I've got a few bagged up and ready to go... with more waiting in the wings:

 

778547cd3958a7564613bc849deb79bc.jpg

 

 

Fitted:

 

8e7cc862d572428674c8178a71e4e3ab.jpg

 

 

 

*** Update 6th April 2015 ****

 

Just so that everyone knows the situation - I keep these in stock and aim to always have stock of them available, so don't worry about checking with me - I'll continue making them until the demand dries up or I get bored of it (and in either case I'll post on here and update).

 

So - available and will be available until I say otherwise on here, just PM me for payment details.

 

Thanks

 

 

*** Update 4th July 2015 ****

 

Still plenty of these in stock, but if you're considering PIDing your machine then check out my latest project: custom aluminium enclosures for the PID - with 45mmx45mm cutout, a wire hole in the back (with grommet) and even some great mounting tape to stick it to your machine. Just £20 delivered for forum members - AND NOW *** SPECIAL OFFER *** if you order a Pt100 sensor AND a case, then the case is just £18 - so sensor and case for £35 delivered

 

See here for more: http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?25140-Aluminium-PID-enclosure-all-cutouts-ready-for-a-PID-to-slot-straight-in&p=322748#post322748

 

Quick photo of the case:

 

859c69ff0f10b0990001003a32cb6762.jpg

 

 

### Update January 2018 ###

I’ve managed to maintain the original price of these for the last few years but with my costs increasing I’ve got no choice but to increase the selling price of these from £15 to £17, still inc UK postage so still providing excellent value (IMO)!

Edited by MrShades

Lots of everything: machines, grinders, roaster, beans, tampers, baskets, blah, blah

However - Too much is never enough!

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These look great and good value. What length is the cable? I would have tested this if it wasn't for the fact the Auber ones are very delicate to take out and install, (I don't want to break it).


Gaggia Classic (IMS screen & basket, OPV, Silvia & PID mod) | Mahlkonig K30

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Cable is 1m long - but could be cut to length if you want... the Auber one is a bit short if you ask me!

 

I don't want to break mine either, so have only bench tested the functionality and fit. Still, if I break one - I just put one of these in (seems like a waste of £25 and the cost of the parts for these though!).

 

They're pretty simple devices to test - as the 100 refers to 100Ohms (and the Pt being Platinum obviously) - which is what the resistance is designed to be at 0c. Thereafter the resistance increases with temp.

 

This is interesting and useful if you have a Pt100 and a multimeter: http://www.tnp-instruments.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/pt100_385c_table.pdf


Lots of everything: machines, grinders, roaster, beans, tampers, baskets, blah, blah

However - Too much is never enough!

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Hi Mrshades looks well made I'd be more than happy to test this if that's ok

cheers James

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Cable is 1m long - but could be cut to length if you want... the Auber one is a bit short if you ask me!

 

I don't want to break mine either, so have only bench tested the functionality and fit. Still, if I break one - I just put one of these in (seems like a waste of £25 and the cost of the parts for these though!).

 

They're pretty simple devices to test - as the 100 refers to 100Ohms (and the Pt being Platinum obviously) - which is what the resistance is designed to be at 0c. Thereafter the resistance increases with temp.

 

This is interesting and useful if you have a Pt100 and a multimeter: http://www.tnp-instruments.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/pt100_385c_table.pdf

 

I found the Auber ones very short too, mine just barely reached the PID terminals. It wasn't ideal as I like leaving slack for cable management.

 

All the DIY PID folk should be snapping this up. Best mentioning this in the Silvia section also. Additionally it's probably best mentioning that this won't fit on specific Silvias as they don't have a threaded thermowell. I remember reading a caveat on Auber's page.

 

Edit - Here:

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=20_15&products_id=21


Gaggia Classic (IMS screen & basket, OPV, Silvia & PID mod) | Mahlkonig K30

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I would like to give one of yours PT100s a trial please. I hope to convert my classic to PID in the next couple of weeks so am happy to be a pilot, or will pay the £15 if I have missed the opportunity.


Profitec PRO 700 : Mazzer SJ Funnel : Heft 585 : Naked PF : La Marzocco 17g

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That's great Krax - will drop you a PM


Lots of everything: machines, grinders, roaster, beans, tampers, baskets, blah, blah

However - Too much is never enough!

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Hi Mrshades works a treat thanks very much for your help it's a lot more accurate/faster than the k type

cheers james

 

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attachment.php?attachmentid=10337&d=1416562717

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Well done James... It's so easy to remove the boiler and makes for MUCH easier fitting of the tc or RTD (I still have the scars on my knuckles from fitting the tc with the boiler in situ!)

 

Having that extra detail in the temp reading makes it all worth while :-)

 

Good stuff...


Lots of everything: machines, grinders, roaster, beans, tampers, baskets, blah, blah

However - Too much is never enough!

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No idea why but steam power has improved again and so has recovery time after steaming I'm running 2c lower going of taste

I've not checked the off set yet just waiting for some JB weld to fully set on my thermofilter but really happy with it so far

cheers james

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Hi MrShades,

could I please order one of your very attractive sensors;)

Moo


Home: Fracino Classico, Mazzer Major

Office: Fracino Little Gem, Mazzer Royal, Anfim Super Best (Decaf)

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I would certainly be interested in one of these if you are making more, am hoping to PID my gaggia classic in the coming weeks!


Gaggia classic (rancillio steam wand, opv mod, unpressurised basket) - Mazzer Super Jolly - Rhino Hand Grinder - Aeropress - Bodum French Press

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These look fantastic - but I know very little about how to fit it and what PID to pair it with. I have an electronic engineering background (but years ago!), so confident enough given instructions. Are there any recommended guides ? I'd be happy to pay the £15 for one... (and will obviously need to go shopping for the PIC etc).

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These look fantastic - but I know very little about how to fit it and what PID to pair it with. I have an electronic engineering background (but years ago!), so confident enough given instructions. Are there any recommended guides ? I'd be happy to pay the £15 for one... (and will obviously need to go shopping for the PIC etc).

 

This should help

http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?19674-DIY-PID-Steam-and-Brew

 

You have a choice of PIDs. These seem to be the most common ones:

 

- Auber

- N2006P or TET612 that are Auber Clones

- Sestos D1S-VR-220

- REX C100

- MyPIN TA4


Gaggia Classic (IMS screen & basket, OPV, Silvia & PID mod) | Mahlkonig K30

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Will try to find time over the coming few days to make some more and will contact those that have expressed interest via PM


Lots of everything: machines, grinders, roaster, beans, tampers, baskets, blah, blah

However - Too much is never enough!

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** Update **

 

See first post for an update - I've now got plenty of stock of these, so if you want one then please PM for payment details etc.

 

The 'new and improved' V2 version is much more professionally built than my previous 'beta' versions... and I have a good supply of them now, so just ask and I can get them in the post ASAP.


Lots of everything: machines, grinders, roaster, beans, tampers, baskets, blah, blah

However - Too much is never enough!

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Dumb question here - I'm planning to go the diy pid route very soon, but haven't fully read (or understood) the instructions.

The classic has 2 thermostats - one for water and one for steam. Does one of these with the pid setup replace both?

 

Thanks

 

Noel


Gaggia Classic, RR55od, Aeropress, Rhino hand grinder, cold brewer...

Saxophones, clarinets, cameras & a lot of PCs

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Dumb question here - I'm planning to go the diy pid route very soon, but haven't fully read (or understood) the instructions.

The classic has 2 thermostats - one for water and one for steam. Does one of these with the pid setup replace both?

 

Thanks

 

Noel

 

Noel, if you ever get around to modding your rr45, please start a thread :p


Gaggia Classic / PID / OPV 9 Bar/V2 Wand/IMS Shower plate/IMS 21g Basket | Sage Pro Grinder + Brasilia RR45 Doser Modded grinder | Reg Barber Radical tamper 58.35 mm | Raw Jersey cow milk (Dreamers Farm Somerset) |(usually Waitrose Spring water, or Ashbeck) | Not enough time

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Yes. The PID works by setting a target temp that is fed back to its controller using the RTD. I have mine set to 102C, giving about 94C on the group due to the temp drop as the water pumps (not tested this drop tho). The PID 'blips' the heater to ensure the temp holds steady at the 102, and comes on for longer periods mid-shot to bring it back up when the water is flowing.

The PID also has an 'alarm' input, and when this is tripped the alarm algorithm takes over and the action of the PID is to bring the temp to whatever the alarm setting is set to, ignoring the 'steady state' of the 102C setting above. The alarm input of the PID is wired up to the steam switch - so this state kicks in when the steam switch is pressed. I have this set to 45C (so the target temp in this state is 102+45=147C).

If you follow the wiring on the google doc, it removed the brew thermostat, and disconnects the steam thermostat.

 

Let me know if you go ahead - I've got a few spares hanging about that I didn't use and could send you....

I have an SSR-40AA on the slow boat that should arrive this week - I wont need this as I got bored waiting and ordered a UK one from Amazon! http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111378737547

Some piggy back connectors I have left (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201022141267)

plenty of 24AWG I wont need (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360880299699 - white)

some tubing for the wires going from the back of the PID into the Classic (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121505712339)

I could spare a few fuses from the 10pk I bought (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291209642586)

That's about it - but if I don't pass them on they'll just sit on a shelf in the garage for the next few years until I chuck them out!

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Yes. The PID works by setting a target temp that is fed back to its controller using the RTD. I have mine set to 102C, giving about 94C on the group due to the temp drop as the water pumps (not tested this drop tho). The PID 'blips' the heater to ensure the temp holds steady at the 102, and comes on for longer periods mid-shot to bring it back up when the water is flowing.

The PID also has an 'alarm' input, and when this is tripped the alarm algorithm takes over and the action of the PID is to bring the temp to whatever the alarm setting is set to, ignoring the 'steady state' of the 102C setting above. The alarm input of the PID is wired up to the steam switch - so this state kicks in when the steam switch is pressed. I have this set to 45C (so the target temp in this state is 102+45=147C).

If you follow the wiring on the google doc, it removed the brew thermostat, and disconnects the steam thermostat.

 

Let me know if you go ahead - I've got a few spares hanging about that I didn't use and could send you....

I have an SSR-40AA on the slow boat that should arrive this week - I wont need this as I got bored waiting and ordered a UK one from Amazon! http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111378737547

Some piggy back connectors I have left (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201022141267)

plenty of 24AWG I wont need (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360880299699 - white)

some tubing for the wires going from the back of the PID into the Classic (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121505712339)

I could spare a few fuses from the 10pk I bought (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291209642586)

That's about it - but if I don't pass them on they'll just sit on a shelf in the garage for the next few years until I chuck them out!

 

Hi there from London- been lurking for a while with the intention of PIDing my classic. Just been reading up and

i would be be happy to buy these bits off you and go with the pre made pt100 on offer by the OP. That means id be able to buy just the pid off amazon(sestos) and get stuck in. Figure I'll need an inline fuse holder and some other mains / silicon awg and assorted crimp terminals. Have recently joined so may not have pm rights. Any help at all would be greatly appreciated. I have only just gotten interested in decent espresso and milk based drinks as a precursor to giving up smoking- need another vice :)

 

I am am a total newb but have carried out the opv and v2 wand mods. Have dialled in my grinder as well (recent eBay purchase) with some 15 day beans.

Edited by JVDAS

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Wow thanks Neil! Speedy response indeed. I will get the kit with ssr then..(itchy trigger finger waiting to buy so that I have weekend to play about) I do have steam / brew in mind but just not sure about steam implementation ( 12v dc ssr or another ac) given that the sestos I understand does not have enough juice to drive second ssr from alarm. Apologies in advance if I have misunderstood or have muddied up thread. Still intend to use op's pt100 tc. Cheers once again GN!

 

ps link to google doc to which you were referring in your earlier post would be much appreciated. I intend to do a step by step for dummies like myself (as a pay it forward for the forum) with no electrical engineering background with the usual disclaimers. I have read the auber guide etc and it looks pretty ok until numerous posts about the lack of documentation for setting up the sestos.. Am I making a schoolboy error in my choice of pid? Just figured I preferred it to the Rex ones which purport to be from japan when they clearly are not ( the ones I've seen anyway) -although many have successfully employed the clones without any adverse effects (fires and the dreaded call to insurers while being given the state of disapproval and emasculation by the mrs).

Edited by JVDAS

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