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Thread: Sage Barista Express Newbie

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rickster1978 View Post
    Thanks for all the comments guys. I知 still finding I知 drawing an espresso that I wouldn稚 be able to drink straight so I知 not getting it quite right. I知 enjoying the experiment though and going to stick with it. I知 not expecting miracles with the remains of my current bag as they were roasted at the start of January so they are getting towards the end of their life. I致e only got one cup left and then I知 away with work until Friday so I値l get my Pact delivery for Saturday morning.

    i still think my main problem is the struggle to know the difference between bitter and sour. I知 struggling to describe the difference which doesn稚 help.

    Going to try this morning and see how I go.
    M
    The main problem with using the machine comes in 2 parts. The web and the manual. On the web Ng in and 2Ng out in either 25 or 30secs can be found. Some bean suppliers might provide numbers usually very similar with maybe a time tolerance. Forget it. People need to find out for themselves. There is no way of knowing what type of machine was used or how well or otherwise it was used or what grinder. Bean tasting is done by dumping grinds into hot water anyway not via an espresso machine

    The manual describes rather precise pressure gauge behaviour. Problem with that is that as ratios are changed the readings it gives with the same dose of grinds will as well. As the output is reduced the gauge will go higher and higher. They provide a 10g basket for 30g shots and an 18g basket for 60g shots. Must be mad but in practice that may be suitable for a bean. Actually I'd be inclined to think from beans I have used that ratios higher than 2 are usually needed just to get the taste they should have.

    The manual and the web mention over and under extraction. It's irrelevant when coupled with specific numbers being used. The aim should be to get a drink that the maker enjoys. That may have the taste associated with a particular bean or a distorted form of it. Some people might use a refractometer and aim for some physical extraction level. I associate that with the strength of the taste. The only control on that is weight of beans, ratio and size of shot produced. Say this was X% and was too weak or too strong. Maybe taste wasn't as it should be.

    Anyway. If some one wants to drink true espresso it would probably be a good idea to ask about beans to use and taste characteristics. For instance taking the shots I use in an americano. If some one took an eye dropper and placed one drop on their tongue to savour it they wouldn't stand a cat in hells chance of appreciating it's flavour and would probably still be able to taste it an hour later. If a milk based drinker used it they might say interesting but too weak. Rather than what I taste they might say chocolate.

    Personally if people want the taste a bean should have the best way to go is americano style. All beans at some grinds weight and ratio will be suitable. So

    John
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    In Use Sage DB+IMS Shower Screen, Niche. Profitec T64. Others Sage BE, Mazer Mini A, Ceado 37J. Projects Little Gem, Gaggia M7D
    Too many filter baskets - maybe. For sale when I get round to it. Robur Elect, Ceado 37J, Ascaso i_1,Piccino

  2. #22
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    I just picked one of these up the other day after selling my gaggia.
    Newbie too.
    Using fresh Rave signature beans
    17 grams in to double unpressurised basket
    Grind setting on 7
    Puck pre heated
    Press the double shot button
    The gauge goes high at around 2om position so past the "ideal espresso range"
    Weighs 58ml out but only in 20 seconds
    I cant seem to get the time past 20 seconds

    Espresso doesn't taste right at all. Its masked in milky drinks though.

    I haven't played with any settings on the programme mode.

    Any ideas?
    Gaggia Classic pre 2015
    Iberital MC2

  3. #23
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    I can only think of 2 things that might cause that.

    Tamping too light. Bound to cause problems at some point as it's mentioned but no numbers. Reckon on >=10kg, Personally I think it's best to strain a little when people are starting as it's more likely to be consistent and hopefully hard enough.

    The other one is too small a dose. Doesn't sound like it should be but easiest way to check is the razor tool. On other machines people might say do a coin test. Say 5p or 1p not leaving an impression when the portafilter is fitted.

    You can work with the gauge going that high but I only needed to do that with the single. It's a bit touchy up there as more and more water goes into the drip tray and the shot the machines buttons gave varies too much. A bit past the blue sector should be ok but I do mean a bit.

    If the gauge happens to go to where Sage suggest it's still a good idea to try higher and lower. Your ratios unusually are in the region sage suggest,

    Grinder setting doesn't sound unreasonable but numbers can't be compared machine to machine. I found Sages suggested start at 8 and added only changing by one step at a time until the taste was as wanted. I'd already used a burr grinder and new that big changes without the grinder running aren't a good idea especially when going finer.

    John
    -
    In Use Sage DB+IMS Shower Screen, Niche. Profitec T64. Others Sage BE, Mazer Mini A, Ceado 37J. Projects Little Gem, Gaggia M7D
    Too many filter baskets - maybe. For sale when I get round to it. Robur Elect, Ceado 37J, Ascaso i_1,Piccino

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajohn View Post
    I can only think of 2 things that might cause that.

    Tamping too light. Bound to cause problems at some point as it's mentioned but no numbers. Reckon on >=10kg, Personally I think it's best to strain a little when people are starting as it's more likely to be consistent and hopefully hard enough.

    The other one is too small a dose. Doesn't sound like it should be but easiest way to check is the razor tool. On other machines people might say do a coin test. Say 5p or 1p not leaving an impression when the portafilter is fitted.

    You can work with the gauge going that high but I only needed to do that with the single. It's a bit touchy up there as more and more water goes into the drip tray and the shot the machines buttons gave varies too much. A bit past the blue sector should be ok but I do mean a bit.

    If the gauge happens to go to where Sage suggest it's still a good idea to try higher and lower. Your ratios unusually are in the region sage suggest,

    Grinder setting doesn't sound unreasonable but numbers can't be compared machine to machine. I found Sages suggested start at 8 and added only changing by one step at a time until the taste was as wanted. I'd already used a burr grinder and new that big changes without the grinder running aren't a good idea especially when going finer.

    John
    -
    I don't think any two machines are the same to be honest. I recently bought two of these and currently have one sat near me at my partner's house. When comparing it to the one I bought for my sister's birthday (end of Feb) I set it up for her. Weighing the grind and adjusting the double shot for a 1:2 ratio shot. Beans were the same on both. Both the grind setting on the side and the grind amount (timer?) were different. The only other difference was the one I bought for her clumped a little bit more.

    I was faffing around trying to make a few flat whites the other day, and found my gf had given the machine a wipe so knocking the grind amount out of the window.. Used the Niche instead that's sat next to it Anyway. a guestimate twist and it's all back to normal now. I get the coffee level when tapping the pf and the tamp shoulders sit level with the top with 18g so should be about right.

    I'm guessing the little filter things that come with it are next to useless if everyone still feels the need to use bottles water? I'm just chucking tap water in at the min.. But will fill a large bottle with water from my machine's filter at home when I get chance
    Input: 'Terranovered Versalab M3 + Mahlkonig EK43 Turkish burrs + Niche
    Output:
    KVdW Speedster
    + V60 + AeroPress + Syphon + Bialetti Induction Moka Pot + Bialetti Mucka Express + jar of instant for visitors..

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