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Thread: Decent espresso

  1. #821
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    Default A new testing tool for your espresso machine.

    We're developing a competitor to the Scace 2 https://www.espressoparts.com/scace-...ressure-device because we ourselves need a number of features that the Scace does not provide.

    We have several Scaces here at Decent Espresso, and they are the standard. However, there are some missing capabilities that we really need. Three other espresso manufacturers I've visited had each created their own hacked-together devices for the same reason.

    We want to be able to measure pressure and water flow digitally, so that we calibrate the internals of our decent espresso machine to match with real measurements. Espresso repairmen use the Scace frequently for this very reason.

    We want to be able change the exit hole size so that we can simulate different flow rates, more closely approximating real espresso flow rates. We're enabling this by using calibrated orifices from Lee http://www.leeimh.com/precision-orifices.htm an American company that we currently use inside our DE1 machines. You can swap the orifice size. This also means that if the hole gets jammed (say, with calcification or a bit of coffee) you can just swap this part out, and not throw the whole thing out. We could supply you with several different hole sizes.

    Our product will be built entirely into a 58mm compatible portafilter basket, so you can use it with your existing bottomless portafilter on any 58mm espresso machine. We won't have to make different models for different types of portafilters.

    For digital output, our plan is to have a battery-powered box included, with an Arduino computer in it, and a two-line LCD showing you pressure and temperature. A USB plug would send data out and which can be stored on a computer via any number of data logging apps. Analysis of pressure and temperature in Excel then becomes possible.

    We're considering having an optional flow rate sensor be able to plug into the output "barb" at the bottom. It would have its own cable that connects to our Arduino box.

    Our interns have been building Arduino-based test devices all summer, so we already have much of this already developed. The new bit to create is the hardware, which Ben has done an initial design of.

    For a few months, this testing tool will only be used by us internally, to ship the 300 espresso machines already ordered, and to work out the bugs in the testing tool. Later in 2017 we could start making this for the public, if there is interest in it.

    Below you'll find photos of our proposed design. I'm very much looking for feedback on these ideas. Please opine!

    dace1.jpg

    dace2.jpg

    dace3.jpg

  2. #822
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    Default Kinky Tubing Rubbing People the Wrong Way

    Several people emailed me to point out that the silicone tubing near the water intake didn't look so happy. We saw that too, and had a meeting later the day I recorded the video, where we moved things around to fix that.

    The problem was that we were asking that tubing to be very short, and to bend sharply. To fix this, the flow meter was moved left a bit, and the intake tubing is now longer, and comes in from the other side of the flow meter. This gives it plenty of length in which to comfortably move.

    We also weren't happy with the water level sensor tube touching and rubbing the side wall, so we've covered that tube with a tough fabric outer sleeve.

    The photo below shows the new parts layout, which we think solves these issues.

    IMG_6889.jpg
    Last edited by decent_espresso; 28-07-17 at 07:51.

  3. #823
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    Default Temperature Probes in Group Head

    The new group head came in yesterday, which now uses "screw in" thermometer probes. We've been using these probes in our mixing chambers and really like how accurate, non leaking, and easily replaced they are.

    One probe dives into the middle of the group to obtain a temperature reading about 5mm above the coffee surface.

    Another probe measures the metal temperature to ensure the group head is accurately preheated.

    All that messy glue from previous prototypes is now banished for good.

    Our "coffee puck" temperature readings will now be more accurate too. Also, if any probe stops working, it's now straightforward to remove and replace it.

    group1.jpg
    group2.jpg

    group3.jpg group4.jpg

  4. #824
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    Default Basic lesson on steaming milk on the DE1

    A number of people have asked "how do you steam milk with your decent espresso machine?" This video gives a short lesson. There are (of course) other ways to steam milk, and if you are a barista, you already know how, so this video is likely of interest to beginners.




  5. #825
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    Thanks John for the many updates really appreciate you work. Hope i am not asking too much but I have three questions with regards to the DE1;

    1) From some of the videos you posted about the DE1 interface its seems with regards to pressure profiling the options are available are prefusion > ramp up to certain pressure > end at certain pressure (3 stages). Would it be possible like the V60 & Vesuvius to instead specify more stages of the profiling ie, hold at 2 bar 5 secs > 6 bar 10 secs > 9 bar 10 secs > 5 bar to the end (4 stages)? I understand that the way your machine works for pressure reading is via the puck instead of internally which i believe the Rocket V60 and Vesuvius are doing; if so would such an option for multiple stages still be feasible in the DE1?

    2) With regards to temperature profiling, i understand that only the DE1+ has the option for manipulating the temperature of the basket via a exclusive portafilter DE1+ thermal prob during the shot.

    Would you be opening the option to DE1 whereby the water output temperature can also be manipulated during the shot at the rudimentary level ie. mixing chamber or boiler, irregardless of the temperature of the basket. I am currently using a HX machine which i am beginning to appreciate the temperature bump during the first 10 seconds of the shot for certain beans; i would certainly appreciate the option to emulate the HX machine temperature profile.

    3) Lastly from your website Specs; you mention that the DE1 is able to "Mimicry" other espresso machine example the Slayer; would that mean it is able to emulate the 30 sec+ slayer style preinfusion?

    I understand that coming from a business decision, alot of the exciting stuff such as indepth manipulation of the machine, flow profiling and basket temp profiling can only be found the the pricer DE1+ due to the more power sensors onboard and more R&D money going into it, however i personally feel that given the lack of such senors on the DE1 does not diminish the potentiality of the machine to do more since on the software level there can be much more manipulation of the machine. It would be great if you could fully maximize the DE1 and "open" up more indepth options for the DE1 users.

  6. #826
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by decent_espresso View Post
    A number of people have asked "how do you steam milk with your decent espresso machine?" This video gives a short lesson.
    Looks like 30 seconds to get to 65C. How much milk was that? 200ml?

  7. #827
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rytopa View Post
    1) From some of the videos you posted about the DE1 interface its seems with regards to pressure profiling the options are available are prefusion > ramp up to certain pressure > end at certain pressure (3 stages). Would it be possible like the V60 & Vesuvius to instead specify more stages of the profiling ie, hold at 2 bar 5 secs > 6 bar 10 secs > 9 bar 10 secs > 5 bar to the end (4 stages)? I understand that the way your machine works for pressure reading is via the puck instead of internally which i believe the Rocket V60 and Vesuvius are doing; if so would such an option for multiple stages still be feasible in the DE1?
    Yes, you can create any number of steps in an espresso shot using the advanced shot editor. I’m in the process of programming it, that’s why you haven’t seen it . The "pressure profile" and "flow profile" tabs are meant to handle most people’s needs, and to make creating the standard profiles quick and simple.

    If you want pauses and pulses, such as for creating a V60 pour-over (yes, we’re working on that) then the advanced shot editor is for you.

    screen 2017-07-29 at 12.31.13 PM.jpg

    Quote Originally Posted by rytopa View Post
    2) With regards to temperature profiling, i understand that only the DE1+ has the option for manipulating the temperature of the basket via a exclusive portafilter DE1+ thermal prob during the shot.
    Would you be opening the option to DE1 whereby the water output temperature can also be manipulated during the shot at the rudimentary level ie. mixing chamber or boiler, irregardless of the temperature of the basket. I am currently using a HX machine which i am beginning to appreciate the temperature bump during the first 10 seconds of the shot for certain beans; i would certainly appreciate the option to emulate the HX machine temperature profile.
    The DE1 is not meant to be a hobbyist/coffee-hacker machine. It will be kept simple, making very nice shots with constant water temperature and variable pressure.

    Quote Originally Posted by rytopa View Post
    3) Lastly from your website Specs; you mention that the DE1 is able to "Mimicry" other espresso machine example the Slayer; would that mean it is able to emulate the 30 sec+ slayer style preinfusion?
    The DE1 can imitate flat-temperature profile machines, with constant flow. You need the DE1+ if you want to imitate a Slayer, because you need precise control over flow to do that.

    The DE1+ will do a better job of imitating other espresso machines, because it can also follow the temperature curve that actually exist in those machines, which the DE1 cannot do.

    Quote Originally Posted by rytopa View Post
    I understand that coming from a business decision, alot of the exciting stuff such as indepth manipulation of the machine, flow profiling and basket temp profiling can only be found the the pricer DE1+ due to the more power sensors onboard and more R&D money going into it, however i personally feel that given the lack of such senors on the DE1 does not diminish the potentiality of the machine to do more since on the software level there can be much more manipulation of the machine. It would be great if you could fully maximize the DE1 and "open" up more indepth options for the DE1 users.
    From a product design perspective, our espresso machine product line is:

    DE1: great espresso for the non coffee-hobbyist, home use, 1 minute per shot
    DE1+ : advanced espresso, for the coffee hobbyist, home use, 1 minute per shot
    DE1PRO+ : advanced espresso, light commercial use, 50 seconds per shot
    DE1CAFE : advanced espresso, heavy commercial use, 35 seconds per shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by roastini View Post
    Looks like 30 seconds to get to 65C. How much milk was that? 200ml?
    It was 150ml.
    We’re in the 35s to 45s range with the DE1/DE1+ to heat a typical 8oz/200ml drink.

    With the DE1PRO that time goes down to about 20-30s.

    With the DE1CAFE that goes down to 12-18s.


  8. #828
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    Default 105 different parts inside a DE1

    I decided to count the total number of different parts inside our DE1 espresso machine, and found that there are 105 different parts. If you're wondering why it takes a long time to go from design to manufacturing, this is part of the reason...

    This screenshot is from the inhouse-created Lotus Notes database we have for keeping track of all parts, vendors and purchases.

    partslist.jpg


  9. #829
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    Default Getting the angle right

    We borrowed a great idea Slayer Espresso had of using mirror to see your espresso as it comes out. We built an angled mirror directly into our DE1 to do this.

    This week, the new mirror design came in: we've enlarged the mirror 50% and angled it much more, so that now you can (1) see much more of the espresso coming out and (2) don't have to bend down to get to the right angle.

    You can see the difference in these before vs after photos.

    Depending on your height, you move yourself forward or back from the DE1, and can remain standing while inspecting your espresso's extraction.

    angle.jpg

  10. #830
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    Default

    Nice price increase .........

    almost 25% on DE1+
    Last edited by Microlot; 31-07-17 at 06:08.

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